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[Music]

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you're in the para cast the gold

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standard of paranormal radio now here's

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Jean Stein so this week we have kind of

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a listener thingy going on here we have

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seen Steinberg Jay Randall Murphy known

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as usual suspect in our forums and

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Lucian who's been a longtime listener

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and participated our forums and we made

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the opportunity available and he was

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sucked in somehow Louis welcome to the

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power cast

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I'm thank you chance a pleasure to be

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here I think it's good to have a history

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lesson for all of our participants had

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got involved I've told my story a

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thousand times Randall has told his

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story what got you involved in studying

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these things you know I want to say it

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started way back with Erich von

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Daniken's Chariots of the Gods when I

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was very young then probably for 20 30

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years that lay dormant and I'd stumble

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across a show on TV

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he was bill birnes show UFO runners and

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actually and I hope I don't consult

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until the first show I thought was

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ridiculous I thought it was so bad I

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wanted to watch the next one but the

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next one caught they caught my attention

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and from there I just kept following

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following the subject I think it's a

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potential game-changer

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I think that's why it's of interest to

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me in particular how the game could be

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changed I can't say with any certainty

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but you can imagine the various

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possibilities whether for good or ill

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and that's why it's of interest to me

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something I think is profoundly

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important have you ever personally had a

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weird experience I have not and that's

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the funny thing so you know I can't say

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it I have it doesn't mean I obviously it

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gives me an added level of skepticism

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but and maybe I'm naive but when I hear

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testimony regarding Bentwaters or

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that men are the allagash abductions or

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or some others if harm you discount so

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many quality witnesses take for example

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as we Keens book chapter after chapter

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and in her case she just focused on

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generals and pilots and have a lot of

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quality Fighting's I think it's worth my

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time and attention paying attention to

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it and given all the effort to discount

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it if anything that heightens my

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suspicion that there's something there

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so I'm afraid I haven't had any any

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actual experiences while telling yours

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actually I don't recall your first one

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other than your brother placing a book

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near you I think you said you've seen a

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few is that correct

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a little more complicated than that

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we'll go to the book in a moment I'm not

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sure whether he did it deliberately or

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but I kind of think he had to because it

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never happened again and hadn't happened

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before and I knew I was interested in

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sci-fi and stuff the experience we're

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talking about here is I don't know I was

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8 to 10 years old living in Brooklyn New

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York I'll tell you the address you can

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look it up on Google Earth 102 Newport

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Street and the reason I mention is this

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was a brownstone for family tenement and

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when we lived there it wasn't a new

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house it had to be 2025 years old it has

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been completely rebuilt it looks almost

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like new and I get the impression here

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that if you wanted to rent that place

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today you'd be spending $2,500 a month

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for our two-bedroom apartment so they've

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done a lot of that it would be a lot of

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places Brooklyn are totally unaffordable

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alright so at night I was getting these

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recurring dreams and to frame it around

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the corner there was a building with a

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large dark canopy in my dreams I see

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this huge canopy or something this huge

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dark thing coming closer and closer

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getting more and more frightening and I

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wake up in a cold sweat and this

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happened for a while almost every night

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and I don't know whether I interacted

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with my parents or my brother who was

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still living at home at the time I don't

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remember that they don't remember

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whether I did or not I know that

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eventually it disappeared also around

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that period I constantly was smelling

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something around me the odor of burnt

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self

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which anyone following John keels

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exploits and his book snows signify

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something this recurring dream vanish

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never happened again I was 11 years old

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my brother lived in a apartment with his

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first wife on Carroll Street in Brooklyn

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it was a short walk from epics field

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this was I think after the Brooklyn

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Dodgers left Brooklyn but you know just

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to give you a framework their first

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apartment he was at work my mom and I

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came over and then on the coffee table

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was a copy of flying saucers from outer

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space by major Donald Kehoe and I have

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no idea why he left it there if not

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knowing that I was gonna be over

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otherwise it made no sense he didn't

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seem to have much of an interest in the

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subject before or since but I read the

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book and I was hooked and now 400 years

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later Here I am so that's my story Lou

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you know we finally ask what was

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Mosley's introduction to the topic why

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was I know you you go back away so can

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may I ask why he was so interested in

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topic Jim was a lot older and he was

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early 20s and late teens when the

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subject first hit the national wires so

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he read those stories there are the UFO

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reports and as I recall the reason he

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got involved with what he called Nexus

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magazine which became saucer news was

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because he had made a deal with somebody

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to do the legwork for a UFO book this is

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like 1953 1954 so he drove around the

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United States and interviewed all the

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people involved in UFO research at the

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time and he put those notes together

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some of that ended up in a book the gray

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Barker kind of wrote for him but heavily

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edited other parts of it ended up in the

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book he wrote with Carl flock called

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shockingly close to the truth in early

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2000s so that's hundred isn't it

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I remember having the notes for a while

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because he typed them up but I assume I

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gave him back to him anyway there was a

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story about that and sister

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that we've told on the power cast before

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we're in the course of all that he

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visited Project Blue Book headquarters

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yeah but and if you recall the story he

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was allowed to type any report that they

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had available for public consumption

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sitting there he typed up as many as he

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could they had a typewriter there he got

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paper any type I don't know how many

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hours or days he spent getting his

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material now up to that point the Air

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Force had also been talking to major

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Donald Kehoe for the books he wrote but

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I gather if you read the books most of

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the stories he got were given to him

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verbally in person or over the phone

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when he learned that Jim had received

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those reports he blew a fuse

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yelled at them and they no longer would

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allow anyone to just come in and type

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the reports down because kyo-ahn ruckus

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why would you do that why would he raise

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a ruckus as there are suspicions I'm

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sorry I think because of the fact that

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he thought that Jim got access to

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something he didn't get access to but

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with just a matter of going in there and

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doing what Jim did Jim did nothing

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special he was nobody special in the

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field of just a guy interested in the

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subject and they were being courteous of

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course major Keyhoe not being courteous

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didn't get me anything

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just as was that I don't know I don't

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know Kehoe that well I mean I've only

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saw I saw him on YouTube on an interview

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with Mike Wallace he seemed professional

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there I mean his reaction that Jim

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Rosalie doesn't sound that all

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professional or helpful or like a team

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player so do you have impressions of

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Keough

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I met Kehoe I think three times I met

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him at nightcap headquarters and I

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didn't realize at the time that nine

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captain's major UFO research

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organization of which he was director

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was mostly run by the in office staff at

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that time was Richard Hall up and Kehoe

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and he lived out in the rain Virginia

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which was I am about 90 miles from DC

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come in a few times a week and check

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things out he was an absentee director

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I also learned later and then Jerry

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Clark confirmed this in his research for

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the book that he wrote the historical

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book you wrote on UFOs he realized that

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Keough was not a very good manager and I

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kept in financial difficulties I think

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because he was a hands-off manager that

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was part of it

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first time I met Kehoe talk to him a

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little bit fact I even volunteered as a

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NICAP member and I wrote up a few

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summaries which I think that Richard

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Hall compiled for use in this book they

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published called UFO evidence so I will

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say I am probably in a very very modest

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way one of the authors of that book

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Lucien is one of our listeners in the

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para cast this week it's me and Randall

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we also have swag you know we have all

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these exclusive para cast things that

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you can buy

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we've got like I guess 60 or so

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different items and entails t-shirts

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sleeves for notebook computers iPad

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cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo

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tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and

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jackets and stuff like that for men and

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women we have a para cast aluminum water

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bottle all the stuff you go to store . ^

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cast comm store dr. power cast comm what

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makes special is that the items are the

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best quality of great t-shirts fabrics

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and they have our official logo on them

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that's what makes them special in

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multiple sizes and colors

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we even have stuff for children stuff

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for women's stuff for men we have all

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sorts of sizes like small up 2x large a

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lot of good stuff that's the swag from

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the para cast to go to store . ^ cast

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calm stop by and take a shopping tour we

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all know that berkey water purification

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systems are the most trusted name in

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water filtration as an authorized Berkey

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dealer for over 6 years in serving

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thousands of satisfied customers the

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Berkey guy offers amazing specials for

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berkey water filtration systems the

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murky light systems include a set of

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self-sterilizing and re cleanable black

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purification elements that purify water

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by removing chlorine pathogenic bacteria

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system parasites to non detectable

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levels and remove harmful chemicals such

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as herbicides and pesticides order the

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Berkey light system today complete with

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two black per key elements for only 231

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dollars and the burka guy will ship your

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order free of charge with the purchase

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of a per key light the burka guy is also

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offering a set of fluoride and arsenic

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filters for only $39.99 that's over 30

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percent off the retail price

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call the burka guy at one eight seven

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seven eight eight six three six five

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we'd like to hear from you if you have a

326
00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:05,709
comment or question about the para cast

327
00:14:13,079 --> 00:14:09,610
sent it to news at the para cast com

328
00:14:15,090 --> 00:14:13,089
that's news at the para cast calm and

329
00:14:18,269 --> 00:14:15,100
don't forget to visit our famous para

330
00:14:22,620 --> 00:14:18,279
cast community forums at forum dot the

331
00:14:25,110 --> 00:14:22,630
para cast calm so one of our listeners

332
00:14:28,740 --> 00:14:25,120
Lucian is joining us in questioning us

333
00:14:30,690 --> 00:14:28,750
he's how interrogating us before he and

334
00:14:32,220 --> 00:14:30,700
Tara gets me further I should tell you

335
00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:32,230
that we have a second radio show called

336
00:14:37,940 --> 00:14:34,810
after the para cast it's only available

337
00:14:42,030 --> 00:14:37,950
if you subscribe to the power cast plus

338
00:14:44,130 --> 00:14:42,040
the show is anything it's off the wall

339
00:14:45,060 --> 00:14:44,140
it's a continuation of an interview it's

340
00:14:47,610 --> 00:14:45,070
unpredictable

341
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:47,620
after the power cast we also offer a

342
00:14:52,170 --> 00:14:48,930
commercial free version of this show

343
00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:52,180
it's available to you as a subscriber

344
00:14:57,660 --> 00:14:55,690
for a modest monthly annual 5 year

345
00:14:59,880 --> 00:14:57,670
lifetime subscription by the way if you

346
00:15:03,150 --> 00:14:59,890
spring for the lifetime in the 5 year

347
00:15:06,269 --> 00:15:03,160
we've got free books to give away so

348
00:15:09,510 --> 00:15:06,279
check those out plus dr. para cast com+

349
00:15:11,250 --> 00:15:09,520
thathe para cast com Lucian was asking

350
00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:11,260
me about my meetings with major Donald

351
00:15:19,620 --> 00:15:16,290
Kehoe so second time 1965 we're on a

352
00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:19,630
trip to Washington DC myself

353
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:21,970
Alan Greenfield old friend of mine from

354
00:15:25,829 --> 00:15:23,770
Brooklyn Marty Salk and and maybe

355
00:15:27,930 --> 00:15:25,839
somebody else not sure about the third

356
00:15:30,300 --> 00:15:27,940
person could have been Rick Hilbert we

357
00:15:33,930 --> 00:15:30,310
all went to Lorraine Virginia met Kehoe

358
00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:33,940
not in the caverns at a diner and we

359
00:15:39,060 --> 00:15:35,730
talked to me seemed pleasant enough and

360
00:15:42,329 --> 00:15:39,070
we had some concerns about night camp

361
00:15:44,790 --> 00:15:42,339
and about the UFO field and we as young

362
00:15:49,260 --> 00:15:44,800
whippersnappers voiced our concerns and

363
00:15:51,810 --> 00:15:49,270
kia was again pleasant easygoing sincere

364
00:15:53,639 --> 00:15:51,820
we then went back to nightcap second

365
00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:53,649
time I've been there Richard Hall sees

366
00:15:58,590 --> 00:15:56,410
me this time and says you're not welcome

367
00:16:00,240 --> 00:15:58,600
here possibly the reason is I was then

368
00:16:02,819 --> 00:16:00,250
working with Jim Mosely a saucer news

369
00:16:05,750 --> 00:16:02,829
after that three of the four of us

370
00:16:08,910 --> 00:16:05,760
already met Ray Palmer and Ray had been

371
00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:08,920
pretty outspoken in his comments about

372
00:16:13,079 --> 00:16:11,050
the UFO field and he ran the club news

373
00:16:13,319 --> 00:16:13,089
section in flying saucers magazine where

374
00:16:16,769 --> 00:16:13,329
we

375
00:16:19,169 --> 00:16:16,779
Palmer's personal number and I called

376
00:16:21,809 --> 00:16:19,179
him and I told him what happened and he

377
00:16:23,759 --> 00:16:21,819
gave us some ideas and suggestions and

378
00:16:26,999 --> 00:16:23,769
then he ran an article in flying saucers

379
00:16:29,789 --> 00:16:27,009
magazine called no investigations can

380
00:16:32,999 --> 00:16:29,799
actually proceed which spells nightcap

381
00:16:35,489 --> 00:16:33,009
and he explained how my cap did some

382
00:16:37,470 --> 00:16:35,499
unfortunate things Jim made a big deal

383
00:16:39,900 --> 00:16:37,480
of it in a saucer news magazine and

384
00:16:44,069 --> 00:16:39,910
other publications took the baton as

385
00:16:46,829 --> 00:16:44,079
well all eventually quit nightcap now I

386
00:16:50,039 --> 00:16:46,839
met him ten years later at a UFO

387
00:16:52,889 --> 00:16:50,049
convention Fort Smith Arkansas I slowly

388
00:16:55,259 --> 00:16:52,899
walked to him I introduced myself he

389
00:16:57,419 --> 00:16:55,269
shook my hand I said we got anything to

390
00:16:59,429 --> 00:16:57,429
talk about he said no we settled our

391
00:17:02,669 --> 00:16:59,439
differences he realized ten years later

392
00:17:04,740 --> 00:17:02,679
he's being absurd I guess or that

393
00:17:07,439 --> 00:17:04,750
whatever happened and precipitated his

394
00:17:08,909 --> 00:17:07,449
anger couldn't be very important my only

395
00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:08,919
regret with Richard Hall by the ways we

396
00:17:13,049 --> 00:17:10,329
didn't get in touch with him early

397
00:17:14,039 --> 00:17:13,059
enough when we started the power cast I

398
00:17:17,460 --> 00:17:14,049
would have loved to have had an

399
00:17:20,429 --> 00:17:17,470
interview he was um he was a gem sure

400
00:17:22,169 --> 00:17:20,439
was a lot of quality work product labor

401
00:17:24,539 --> 00:17:22,179
Dawei contributed a lot to the field

402
00:17:26,879 --> 00:17:24,549
could I go ahead in Turkey oh well I'll

403
00:17:29,700 --> 00:17:26,889
just tell you Hall and also John keel

404
00:17:32,340 --> 00:17:29,710
both died in extreme poverty yeah you

405
00:17:35,279 --> 00:17:32,350
hold it no Keogh did wasn't he retired

406
00:17:38,940 --> 00:17:35,289
not taeho major Richard Hall oh I'm here

407
00:17:41,330 --> 00:17:38,950
John Kehoe all right Don Quijano

408
00:17:44,250 --> 00:17:41,340
I interviewed him there for national

409
00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:44,260
supermarket tabloid Donald feed oh very

410
00:17:48,389 --> 00:17:45,850
nice interview okay I call him the

411
00:17:49,980 --> 00:17:48,399
father of ufology some people say that

412
00:17:52,350 --> 00:17:49,990
Ray Palmer was really the father of

413
00:17:53,759 --> 00:17:52,360
ufology because he publicized the

414
00:17:55,919 --> 00:17:53,769
subject in the early years and fate

415
00:17:58,200 --> 00:17:55,929
magazine and elsewhere but a lot of

416
00:18:00,810 --> 00:17:58,210
people got their interest in UFOs then

417
00:18:02,700 --> 00:18:00,820
four major Keyhoe I wrote this article

418
00:18:04,590 --> 00:18:02,710
it was published in the supermarket

419
00:18:07,500 --> 00:18:04,600
tabloid that went out of business a few

420
00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:07,510
weeks later I never got paid for it so

421
00:18:12,779 --> 00:18:09,250
if I can find the manuscript somewhere

422
00:18:14,159 --> 00:18:12,789
I'll run it because they have no rights

423
00:18:15,659 --> 00:18:14,169
to it they didn't pay me I mean not that

424
00:18:17,340 --> 00:18:15,669
they would pay me a lot maybe a few

425
00:18:20,860 --> 00:18:17,350
hundred dollars but would have been nice

426
00:18:25,029 --> 00:18:20,870
to have I'd take it even to think yeah

427
00:18:28,090 --> 00:18:25,039
and Keo again was a nice guy Keo had a

428
00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:28,100
decent public persona a lot of people

429
00:18:32,470 --> 00:18:29,690
liked him I mean you could criticize

430
00:18:34,180 --> 00:18:32,480
things he did I think he made a number

431
00:18:36,580 --> 00:18:34,190
of mistakes and we can go into that if

432
00:18:38,799 --> 00:18:36,590
you like but at the end you seem like a

433
00:18:40,899 --> 00:18:38,809
nice guy and that's how I remember him

434
00:18:42,460 --> 00:18:40,909
hi I do have some other questions let me

435
00:18:44,860 --> 00:18:42,470
get you to drill down on something I

436
00:18:48,580 --> 00:18:44,870
really want to try to pin you down what

437
00:18:50,799 --> 00:18:48,590
are some UFO events that convinced you

438
00:18:52,630 --> 00:18:50,809
to remain particularly interested in

439
00:18:55,779 --> 00:18:52,640
this field I don't want to hear about

440
00:18:58,090 --> 00:18:55,789
criticisms move on or passagio or good

441
00:19:00,220 --> 00:18:58,100
or for other folks I want to hear what

442
00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:00,230
you really like what you really think

443
00:19:04,899 --> 00:19:01,970
has been enlightening is worthy of

444
00:19:07,210 --> 00:19:04,909
further study go ahead I think there are

445
00:19:10,450 --> 00:19:07,220
thousands and thousands and thousands of

446
00:19:13,299 --> 00:19:10,460
UFO sightings okay that are compelling

447
00:19:15,490 --> 00:19:13,309
that we can't explain away we have all

448
00:19:19,330 --> 00:19:15,500
the stuff that we've talked about

449
00:19:21,340 --> 00:19:19,340
through the years pinpoint turns we

450
00:19:23,470 --> 00:19:21,350
talked about simultaneous radar and

451
00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:23,480
visual sightings even though it's pretty

452
00:19:28,029 --> 00:19:26,690
easy to cloak I think a craft so they

453
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:28,039
don't care whether they're seen or not

454
00:19:33,090 --> 00:19:30,890
we have people who have seen them really

455
00:19:36,430 --> 00:19:33,100
up-close we have all these interactions

456
00:19:37,990 --> 00:19:36,440
we have possible trace evidence so at

457
00:19:40,870 --> 00:19:38,000
the very beginning and end of the day

458
00:19:44,380 --> 00:19:40,880
it's not about one case because one case

459
00:19:44,860 --> 00:19:44,390
may live or die by some level of

460
00:19:49,690 --> 00:19:44,870
evidence

461
00:19:53,139 --> 00:19:49,700
that can't be readily dismissed that say

462
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:53,149
something weird is going on and wouldn't

463
00:19:57,310 --> 00:19:54,850
it be nice to find out what it is

464
00:20:01,000 --> 00:19:57,320
gene I think you you've hit the nail on

465
00:20:03,639 --> 00:20:01,010
the head there because personally I'm a

466
00:20:06,279 --> 00:20:03,649
believer but if I were asked to prove

467
00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:06,289
any individual cases it doesn't seem

468
00:20:11,350 --> 00:20:08,090
possible given the evidence that we've

469
00:20:14,230 --> 00:20:11,360
got at hand so we have to at some point

470
00:20:15,570 --> 00:20:14,240
say what's reasonable to believe and it

471
00:20:18,310 --> 00:20:15,580
just seems to me that it's not

472
00:20:21,010 --> 00:20:18,320
reasonable to believe that everything is

473
00:20:24,850 --> 00:20:21,020
the result of misperceptions and hoaxes

474
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:24,860
and mundane objects if you do your

475
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:26,570
homework on it it just doesn't seem

476
00:20:31,330 --> 00:20:28,970
reasonable well the thing you also have

477
00:20:34,130 --> 00:20:31,340
to realize here is that some cases still

478
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:34,140
fall apart I think Roswell has fallen up

479
00:20:38,180 --> 00:20:36,210
really big-time not that something

480
00:20:40,010 --> 00:20:38,190
didn't happen there but when you have

481
00:20:42,020 --> 00:20:40,020
someone like Kevin and Randall who's

482
00:20:44,300 --> 00:20:42,030
been after Roswell for 30 years and

483
00:20:46,340 --> 00:20:44,310
finally comes up with this book Roswell

484
00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:46,350
in the 21st century where he looks at it

485
00:20:52,010 --> 00:20:49,290
as a cold case and decides you know what

486
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:52,020
some of this evidence is not as strong

487
00:20:56,270 --> 00:20:53,970
as I thought it would be especially the

488
00:20:58,490 --> 00:20:56,280
possibility of aliens being seeing

489
00:21:02,060 --> 00:20:58,500
connection with this alleged crashed

490
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:02,070
spaceship so his end up story is

491
00:21:06,050 --> 00:21:03,570
something happened there we haven't

492
00:21:09,350 --> 00:21:06,060
explained it it doesn't necessarily mean

493
00:21:11,870 --> 00:21:09,360
it's UFOs spaceships whatever something

494
00:21:13,550 --> 00:21:11,880
happened we could look at body-snatchers

495
00:21:17,810 --> 00:21:13,560
in the desert the book from Nick Redfern

496
00:21:20,630 --> 00:21:17,820
as a failed experiment a lot of things

497
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:20,640
were happening in late 40s and early 50s

498
00:21:26,090 --> 00:21:23,090
that may relate to testing and

499
00:21:28,190 --> 00:21:26,100
development of stuff technology first

500
00:21:30,380 --> 00:21:28,200
retrieved from the Nazis during World

501
00:21:32,750 --> 00:21:30,390
War two and the fact we don't see it

502
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:32,760
anymore may indicate to me very little

503
00:21:37,010 --> 00:21:35,370
of it worked very well I guess except

504
00:21:39,650 --> 00:21:37,020
the v2 rocket which became the

505
00:21:42,590 --> 00:21:39,660
progenitor of all our rocket ships since

506
00:21:44,330 --> 00:21:42,600
then I know Roswell is a bit doir of

507
00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:44,340
this particular program I've heard

508
00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:46,050
repeatedly they just we don't like to

509
00:21:50,150 --> 00:21:48,090
hear about her name work so I think what

510
00:21:51,410 --> 00:21:50,160
resurrects the case at least for me and

511
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:51,420
I'm sorry it's like it's a man's name

512
00:21:55,220 --> 00:21:53,640
wrong but it was it for gear the man who

513
00:21:57,410 --> 00:21:55,230
analyzed the photographs you actually

514
00:21:59,000 --> 00:21:57,420
had an interview with Ron Rudy ramadhir

515
00:22:01,370 --> 00:21:59,010
he's an engineer with some really

516
00:22:03,380 --> 00:22:01,380
stellar qualifications he acquired

517
00:22:05,090 --> 00:22:03,390
photographs from somewhere in Texas I

518
00:22:07,310 --> 00:22:05,100
need University of Texas fill in the

519
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:07,320
blank I don't know the town he had the

520
00:22:11,660 --> 00:22:09,690
original sent to him he blew him off and

521
00:22:13,940 --> 00:22:11,670
he analyzed the photos I don't know if

522
00:22:16,460 --> 00:22:13,950
the word would be compelling but it's

523
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:16,470
it's dramatic trying to fill in those

524
00:22:20,510 --> 00:22:18,690
blanks it's very suggestive when you see

525
00:22:23,330 --> 00:22:20,520
the word disc when it's deny that

526
00:22:26,930 --> 00:22:23,340
there's a disc you see that transport

527
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:26,940
transport him something to another town

528
00:22:30,730 --> 00:22:28,890
in Fort Worth Utley it was in Texas and

529
00:22:33,890 --> 00:22:30,740
the reason I mention this is because

530
00:22:36,110 --> 00:22:33,900
balloons they were just a lot in the Sun

531
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:36,120
when they came down listener Lucien

532
00:22:48,070 --> 00:22:38,970
joins us and he's interrogating gene and

533
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:53,070
thank you for listening to GCN

534
00:23:00,210 --> 00:22:58,350
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641
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this is actually you're listening to the

642
00:27:24,340 --> 00:27:13,000
podcast the gold standard of Grenoble

643
00:27:30,169 --> 00:27:27,799
solution is asking me about ranma gears

644
00:27:32,900 --> 00:27:30,179
material i'm not gonna comment about it

645
00:27:34,850 --> 00:27:32,910
except to say he was once going to be

646
00:27:38,210 --> 00:27:34,860
doing a book for richard.reimers

647
00:27:40,610 --> 00:27:38,220
publishing company right yeah another

648
00:27:42,100 --> 00:27:40,620
don't talk over me Louie just kind of

649
00:27:44,930 --> 00:27:42,110
confuse things three two one

650
00:27:46,940 --> 00:27:44,940
look I think he was giving it the

651
00:27:50,030 --> 00:27:46,950
working title another damn Roswell book

652
00:27:52,010 --> 00:27:50,040
I'm gonna ask him and if we got an

653
00:27:54,860 --> 00:27:52,020
answer before the show ends I'll let you

654
00:27:58,549 --> 00:27:54,870
know what it is okay mmm it sure looks

655
00:28:01,310 --> 00:27:58,559
like the photograph of Jesse Marcel on

656
00:28:03,919 --> 00:28:01,320
his knees with I believe he his

657
00:28:06,140 --> 00:28:03,929
commanding officer in the office trying

658
00:28:09,289 --> 00:28:06,150
to represent that the Roswell crash

659
00:28:12,250 --> 00:28:09,299
debris was a weather balloon I've never

660
00:28:15,470 --> 00:28:12,260
heard anyone questioned the veracity of

661
00:28:18,169 --> 00:28:15,480
any of those representations so what are

662
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:18,179
you saying yeah it's a standard rise mo

663
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:22,890
photograph and I can tell you in looking

664
00:28:26,419 --> 00:28:24,570
at that that that represents anything

665
00:28:29,330 --> 00:28:26,429
more than whatever you see than a

666
00:28:31,610 --> 00:28:29,340
balloon what but the commanding officer

667
00:28:34,130 --> 00:28:31,620
is on his in a photograph holding a

668
00:28:36,289 --> 00:28:34,140
piece of paper and I believe they blew

669
00:28:38,030 --> 00:28:36,299
up that piece okay I know what you're

670
00:28:41,270 --> 00:28:38,040
talking about here okay that particular

671
00:28:44,299 --> 00:28:41,280
letter yeah what does it say and that's

672
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:44,309
the area speculation and I think at this

673
00:28:49,220 --> 00:28:46,770
point we can do all the digital

674
00:28:51,409 --> 00:28:49,230
interpolation we want and maybe someday

675
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:51,419
we'll see what it says but that doesn't

676
00:28:54,710 --> 00:28:53,010
prove anything and only proves she's

677
00:28:56,299 --> 00:28:54,720
holding some kind of memo or a letter

678
00:28:58,669 --> 00:28:56,309
and wouldn't we like to know what

679
00:29:00,380 --> 00:28:58,679
everything is in that letter I believe

680
00:29:03,500 --> 00:29:00,390
it's pretty clear that the word disk is

681
00:29:06,260 --> 00:29:03,510
there the word Fort Worth is there again

682
00:29:09,130 --> 00:29:06,270
I'm trusting the person who did the

683
00:29:11,870 --> 00:29:09,140
enhancements to not be pulling my leg

684
00:29:14,990 --> 00:29:11,880
which in theory could be happening but

685
00:29:16,909 --> 00:29:15,000
those words are pretty clear and why

686
00:29:18,950 --> 00:29:16,919
would those words be on a piece of paper

687
00:29:22,340 --> 00:29:18,960
in someone's hand when they're trying to

688
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:22,350
portray a fallen see what a balloon is

689
00:29:26,870 --> 00:29:24,330
the Roswell debris just the

690
00:29:29,419 --> 00:29:26,880
circumstantial evidence of all of it

691
00:29:32,780 --> 00:29:29,429
suggests that it's a memo relating to

692
00:29:35,390 --> 00:29:32,790
the debris and it suggests that what's

693
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:35,400
in the office is not the debris that was

694
00:29:39,289 --> 00:29:36,090
truly

695
00:29:41,330 --> 00:29:39,299
if you specify discs he may just be

696
00:29:43,909 --> 00:29:41,340
refer to the original story the original

697
00:29:45,529 --> 00:29:43,919
story said was a disc it was a flying

698
00:29:47,539 --> 00:29:45,539
disc or something and then they changed

699
00:29:49,879 --> 00:29:47,549
it oh it was a weather balloon Fort

700
00:29:51,739 --> 00:29:49,889
Worth could be a base of operations I

701
00:29:54,409 --> 00:29:51,749
don't know the point is here is you're

702
00:29:56,839 --> 00:29:54,419
taking a handful of words and trying to

703
00:29:59,269 --> 00:29:56,849
fill in the blanks I can't fill in those

704
00:30:01,039 --> 00:29:59,279
blanks and I think we shouldn't stretch

705
00:30:03,499 --> 00:30:01,049
it to try to fill in the blanks unless

706
00:30:05,749 --> 00:30:03,509
we could really take it apart we don't

707
00:30:08,659 --> 00:30:05,759
know what that memo is we don't know

708
00:30:10,940 --> 00:30:08,669
what those words signify that memo may

709
00:30:12,769 --> 00:30:10,950
have that memo may have nothing to do

710
00:30:14,570 --> 00:30:12,779
with Roswell maybe just a memo he had in

711
00:30:17,149 --> 00:30:14,580
his hand about something else he has to

712
00:30:18,529 --> 00:30:17,159
do after he took that visit you see what

713
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:18,539
I'm saying I don't know there's no

714
00:30:23,599 --> 00:30:21,570
context but in fact they're just they're

715
00:30:26,779 --> 00:30:23,609
explaining Roswell at that moment and

716
00:30:29,450 --> 00:30:26,789
was a high-profile event and it makes

717
00:30:32,239 --> 00:30:29,460
sense that you intended material around

718
00:30:34,639 --> 00:30:32,249
him about that off that subject you know

719
00:30:36,919 --> 00:30:34,649
what reasonable people can disagree to

720
00:30:39,649 --> 00:30:36,929
me unfortunately there are a lot of

721
00:30:42,049 --> 00:30:39,659
witnesses to that event or surrounding

722
00:30:44,539 --> 00:30:42,059
events who have not told the truth

723
00:30:47,749 --> 00:30:44,549
many who have not told the truth which

724
00:30:50,149 --> 00:30:47,759
really really hurts the story does that

725
00:30:52,969 --> 00:30:50,159
disprove that something significant

726
00:30:55,909 --> 00:30:52,979
happened no that's all I can say I mean

727
00:30:57,919 --> 00:30:55,919
again when you have Jesse Marcel making

728
00:31:00,109 --> 00:30:57,929
these claims and you have his son taking

729
00:31:01,579 --> 00:31:00,119
the claims that he did there's some

730
00:31:03,649 --> 00:31:01,589
weight to the story there was something

731
00:31:05,359 --> 00:31:03,659
significant that happened and then you

732
00:31:08,719 --> 00:31:05,369
have a again we won't have to go into

733
00:31:10,759 --> 00:31:08,729
the picture so i'm i still have a i had

734
00:31:13,099 --> 00:31:10,769
my suspicions about that case as well

735
00:31:15,879 --> 00:31:13,109
and given the context remember recently

736
00:31:19,759 --> 00:31:15,889
just recently before then that Marnell

737
00:31:22,459 --> 00:31:19,769
had seen those was his hat her what was

738
00:31:25,039 --> 00:31:22,469
his name arnold who saw the flying discs

739
00:31:28,009 --> 00:31:25,049
in the state of washington about that

740
00:31:29,479 --> 00:31:28,019
same time a little before so I mean

741
00:31:32,029 --> 00:31:29,489
there's a lot more to the context than

742
00:31:34,310 --> 00:31:32,039
might appear at first glance so go ahead

743
00:31:36,109 --> 00:31:34,320
and Jean okay well you talk by Kenneth

744
00:31:38,899 --> 00:31:36,119
Arnold about the original striding

745
00:31:43,129 --> 00:31:38,909
ionized shaped objects near Mount Ranier

746
00:31:44,839 --> 00:31:43,139
in Washington State June 24th 1947 and

747
00:31:47,029 --> 00:31:44,849
it came at the right time to get

748
00:31:49,190 --> 00:31:47,039
national publicity and thus generated

749
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:49,200
the flying saucer myth a legend

750
00:31:55,730 --> 00:31:51,930
now there were other sightings at the

751
00:31:59,120 --> 00:31:55,740
time but a lot of the linchpin of this

752
00:32:01,640 --> 00:31:59,130
case is basically resting on Arnold's

753
00:32:06,100 --> 00:32:01,650
estimate of the speed I think was over

754
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:06,110
1500 miles an hour and I think if it was

755
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:08,730
substantially less it could be some kind

756
00:32:13,330 --> 00:32:10,770
of conventional test aircraft I have no

757
00:32:16,070 --> 00:32:13,340
idea especially if you give it a little

758
00:32:18,530 --> 00:32:16,080
variation in descriptions maybe we don't

759
00:32:20,630 --> 00:32:18,540
know the question here is that doesn't

760
00:32:22,070 --> 00:32:20,640
tell us what Roswell was it only tells

761
00:32:25,460 --> 00:32:22,080
us that Kenneth Arnold saw something

762
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:25,470
strange reported it and this is one of

763
00:32:30,350 --> 00:32:27,810
the ways in which the flying saucer

764
00:32:32,420 --> 00:32:30,360
legend began Ray Palmer got in touch

765
00:32:34,820 --> 00:32:32,430
with Arnold I guessed developed a

766
00:32:38,510 --> 00:32:34,830
friendship with him and assigned Arnold

767
00:32:40,460 --> 00:32:38,520
to go to Maury island and we remember

768
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:40,470
the Maury Island incident that was

769
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:42,290
chronicled in the coming of the saucers

770
00:32:49,430 --> 00:32:46,530
that Arnold and Palmer wrote so they

771
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:49,440
were the early days of the establishment

772
00:32:54,170 --> 00:32:51,450
of the Flying Saucer legend fate

773
00:32:57,140 --> 00:32:54,180
magazine promoted it extensively with

774
00:33:00,230 --> 00:32:57,150
early coverage so we could look at it

775
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:00,240
that way but between Roswell and Arnold

776
00:33:04,010 --> 00:33:01,290
I don't know what the connection could

777
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:04,020
be just the time I think what year was

778
00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:08,610
that did 70 those 47 years and Roswell

779
00:33:13,220 --> 00:33:10,770
was also in 47 and then again we were

780
00:33:15,620 --> 00:33:13,230
discussing discs that's I think the

781
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:15,630
connection implying that there was a

782
00:33:21,470 --> 00:33:17,850
wave at the time and again it tracks

783
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:21,480
back to the atomic detonations in New

784
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:23,490
Mexico I don't want to dwell on this

785
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:25,530
case but I think the gentleman's

786
00:33:32,330 --> 00:33:28,370
photographs and photographic analysis

787
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:32,340
raises very very compelling questions so

788
00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:34,410
teach his own and you can move on to

789
00:33:39,710 --> 00:33:36,450
other cases because again I know this is

790
00:33:42,350 --> 00:33:39,720
about favorite topic of the hosts of

791
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:42,360
this this show you know by the way that

792
00:33:46,190 --> 00:33:44,490
was the episode that I saw on UFO

793
00:33:48,350 --> 00:33:46,200
hundreds that I thought was so weak that

794
00:33:50,570 --> 00:33:48,360
I just laughed and laughed but

795
00:33:52,130 --> 00:33:50,580
subsequently found stronger shows and

796
00:33:54,290 --> 00:33:52,140
became interested in the topic it was

797
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:54,300
the morning island show of UFO Hunters

798
00:33:57,830 --> 00:33:56,610
bill birnes by the way has disappeared

799
00:34:00,290 --> 00:33:57,840
from the scene maybe you should get him

800
00:34:02,210 --> 00:34:00,300
back on the show and find out what he's

801
00:34:02,870 --> 00:34:02,220
been up to you know something

802
00:34:05,210 --> 00:34:02,880
interesting here

803
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:05,220
I had some correspondence with bill

804
00:34:11,090 --> 00:34:08,010
birnes couple of viewers back and I

805
00:34:14,149 --> 00:34:11,100
asked him to come on and talk we all

806
00:34:16,100 --> 00:34:14,159
have questions he by the way will deny

807
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:16,110
if you ask him that he controlled some

808
00:34:25,490 --> 00:34:19,850
of the weird things that were done on

809
00:34:27,139 --> 00:34:25,500
UFO Hunters like the editing of Chris

810
00:34:28,940 --> 00:34:27,149
O'Brien's comments where something

811
00:34:31,490 --> 00:34:28,950
happening in the mysterious valley ends

812
00:34:34,210 --> 00:34:31,500
up being transported by the matter

813
00:34:37,100 --> 00:34:34,220
transporter to Sedona Arizona

814
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:37,110
he calls it Franken editing or something

815
00:34:41,629 --> 00:34:39,330
or Frankenstein editing I don't know so

816
00:34:43,820 --> 00:34:41,639
well he's yeah he seems to be guilty of

817
00:34:47,780 --> 00:34:43,830
that with Corsos book twos Oh I mean

818
00:34:50,570 --> 00:34:47,790
burns yeah I mean I mean I almost dare

819
00:34:52,580 --> 00:34:50,580
him to come on to the show because you

820
00:34:55,460 --> 00:34:52,590
know that may be why he sort of decided

821
00:34:57,170 --> 00:34:55,470
to lay low a bit yeah he's been you know

822
00:34:59,960 --> 00:34:57,180
very much sensationalized the whole

823
00:35:03,170 --> 00:34:59,970
thing and and it seems to be for the

824
00:35:05,570 --> 00:35:03,180
purpose of gaining media exposure yeah I

825
00:35:08,540 --> 00:35:05,580
know if it's that because I never

826
00:35:10,070 --> 00:35:08,550
thought that bill burns was ever afraid

827
00:35:11,330 --> 00:35:10,080
to answer any question it doesn't mean

828
00:35:13,370 --> 00:35:11,340
whether you would agree with the answer

829
00:35:15,950 --> 00:35:13,380
or not I just don't think he was afraid

830
00:35:18,380 --> 00:35:15,960
I'm gonna look up as we're talking as a

831
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:18,390
matter of fact and you would hear my

832
00:35:25,580 --> 00:35:21,570
typewriter going my keys bill burns I'm

833
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:25,590
gonna look at the last time that I heard

834
00:35:33,410 --> 00:35:30,330
from him and this goes back well here's

835
00:35:39,140 --> 00:35:33,420
some letters from 2008 I know that came

836
00:35:45,350 --> 00:35:39,150
by later so let's see bill burns let's

837
00:35:45,710 --> 00:35:45,360
see okay all right 2009 we're getting

838
00:35:51,650 --> 00:35:45,720
there

839
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:51,660
and let's see what let's try it this way

840
00:35:59,840 --> 00:35:54,650
we're trying all the search tools here

841
00:36:08,690 --> 00:35:59,850
using Apple's spotlight to locate bill

842
00:36:17,910 --> 00:36:13,550
alright last I heard was two years ago

843
00:36:21,630 --> 00:36:17,920
he was the midst of doing a lot of edits

844
00:36:25,740 --> 00:36:21,640
on some kind of book rather I wrote to

845
00:36:28,620 --> 00:36:25,750
him and have not heard anything since so

846
00:36:31,940 --> 00:36:28,630
September 2015

847
00:36:36,170 --> 00:36:31,950
we've got Luis Sheehan and he is

848
00:36:44,310 --> 00:36:36,180
interrogating Jean and Randall you're in

849
00:36:53,620 --> 00:36:48,720
[Music]

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960
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Lucian has had the trial by fire uh

961
00:41:29,190 --> 00:41:27,420
getting back to Bill burns he and his

962
00:41:32,970 --> 00:41:29,200
wife had a show for some time that

963
00:41:35,339 --> 00:41:32,980
hasn't been on since 2016 I don't I

964
00:41:36,870 --> 00:41:35,349
happen to know that Nancy is publishing

965
00:41:38,849 --> 00:41:36,880
some books but I don't know what Bill's

966
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:38,859
been up to I wondered if he's in the

967
00:41:42,900 --> 00:41:40,690
process of doing a youth another season

968
00:41:45,029 --> 00:41:42,910
the vehicle hunters but I have a zero

969
00:41:47,220 --> 00:41:45,039
influx ID information I just don't know

970
00:41:48,599 --> 00:41:47,230
what he's up to and I thought maybe you

971
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:48,609
would or you would getting back on the

972
00:41:54,809 --> 00:41:51,970
show and find out what he's been up to

973
00:41:57,900 --> 00:41:54,819
you know a vibrant aspect of ufology

974
00:42:00,420 --> 00:41:57,910
community and disagree with him or not

975
00:42:02,700 --> 00:42:00,430
he's an important player perhaps he'll

976
00:42:05,220 --> 00:42:02,710
have time to put him on another show if

977
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:05,230
there's a way we will do it I'm just

978
00:42:10,829 --> 00:42:08,410
doing a traditional sort of check out

979
00:42:15,079 --> 00:42:10,839
here in Google

980
00:42:20,549 --> 00:42:15,089
he appeared this year on coast to coast

981
00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:20,559
okay okay well I'm glad of that I will

982
00:42:25,620 --> 00:42:23,890
contact him and I'll see if you do get

983
00:42:28,170 --> 00:42:25,630
him on I think that'd be a good show to

984
00:42:30,809 --> 00:42:28,180
get Don Ecker in on because I think that

985
00:42:33,569 --> 00:42:30,819
didn't he take over UFO magazine from

986
00:42:36,329 --> 00:42:33,579
dark oh that is such a story okay he

987
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:36,339
takes over UFO magazine I don't you know

988
00:42:41,190 --> 00:42:38,410
want to go back into everything here

989
00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:41,200
dawn tells the story he took over the

990
00:42:50,039 --> 00:42:46,930
magazine and Don Ecker and Vicki you

991
00:42:52,229 --> 00:42:50,049
know disengaged themselves I don't think

992
00:42:55,049 --> 00:42:52,239
he feels confident that he got the best

993
00:42:57,180 --> 00:42:55,059
deal or that the magazine was treated in

994
00:42:59,609 --> 00:42:57,190
the way he expected when they took it

995
00:43:02,009 --> 00:42:59,619
over at some point they kind of gave it

996
00:43:04,049 --> 00:43:02,019
up but then it's complicated because

997
00:43:05,789 --> 00:43:04,059
supposedly a third party owned the

998
00:43:07,140 --> 00:43:05,799
rights to the magazine a production

999
00:43:09,989 --> 00:43:07,150
company like a movie production company

1000
00:43:13,410 --> 00:43:09,999
owned the rights to UFO magazine and

1001
00:43:14,700 --> 00:43:13,420
pulled the plug and that's it they tried

1002
00:43:18,009 --> 00:43:14,710
to turn a ditch

1003
00:43:21,430 --> 00:43:18,019
Nancy and Bill and it didn't work and

1004
00:43:23,410 --> 00:43:21,440
that's the end of it we can ask I don't

1005
00:43:26,259 --> 00:43:23,420
know if he wants to debate Don Ecker

1006
00:43:28,630 --> 00:43:26,269
about it but let's get the information I

1007
00:43:32,349 --> 00:43:28,640
think at the very end what happened in

1008
00:43:36,190 --> 00:43:32,359
part was Nancy went on hiatus to write a

1009
00:43:37,809 --> 00:43:36,200
book for George Noory and so she put out

1010
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:37,819
publishing the magazine which allowed

1011
00:43:42,940 --> 00:43:40,490
the subscription numbers to drop so low

1012
00:43:45,549 --> 00:43:42,950
that the owner of the title was allowed

1013
00:43:48,190 --> 00:43:45,559
to yank back ownership of the magazine

1014
00:43:51,250 --> 00:43:48,200
the owner the true owner of the title

1015
00:43:53,410 --> 00:43:51,260
wanted to sell it to open minds and that

1016
00:43:55,660 --> 00:43:53,420
sell through that's my understanding of

1017
00:43:57,460 --> 00:43:55,670
what went on I know that that's the

1018
00:43:59,140 --> 00:43:57,470
specific of what I was talking about

1019
00:44:01,870 --> 00:43:59,150
that was owned by production company

1020
00:44:04,420 --> 00:44:01,880
pull the plug but what you're saying is

1021
00:44:07,170 --> 00:44:04,430
the same is what I heard that Nancy had

1022
00:44:09,910 --> 00:44:07,180
her attention diverted to something else

1023
00:44:11,710 --> 00:44:09,920
intentionally only briefly but while

1024
00:44:13,150 --> 00:44:11,720
that happened the other persons I heard

1025
00:44:15,609 --> 00:44:13,160
the owners took advantage of that and

1026
00:44:17,250 --> 00:44:15,619
tried to make a short-term profit which

1027
00:44:20,109 --> 00:44:17,260
fell through though so everybody lost

1028
00:44:22,660 --> 00:44:20,119
the shame of it all I don't think it was

1029
00:44:24,039 --> 00:44:22,670
ever an intention to it was ever their

1030
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:24,049
intention to stop publishing that

1031
00:44:27,819 --> 00:44:26,690
magazine so that's where all that lays

1032
00:44:29,890 --> 00:44:27,829
Don Ecker

1033
00:44:32,589 --> 00:44:29,900
also have new has a new show on another

1034
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:32,599
network perhaps you guys are aware of it

1035
00:44:35,079 --> 00:44:34,490
yes he talked about it the last time I

1036
00:44:37,299 --> 00:44:35,089
was here

1037
00:44:38,470 --> 00:44:37,309
and how about Robert Hastings I'm

1038
00:44:40,150 --> 00:44:38,480
changing this subject

1039
00:44:43,450 --> 00:44:40,160
you haven't had him on since he put out

1040
00:44:45,430 --> 00:44:43,460
his new movie a short movie roughly tied

1041
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:45,440
to his book his book by the way as much

1042
00:44:51,069 --> 00:44:48,890
broader than his primary focus of UFOs

1043
00:44:52,210 --> 00:44:51,079
and nukes and it's not a subject of

1044
00:44:54,460 --> 00:44:52,220
interest in mine but the cattle

1045
00:44:58,059 --> 00:44:54,470
mutilations topic is touched on I

1046
00:45:00,609 --> 00:44:58,069
noticed as is for that matter Rendlesham

1047
00:45:04,150 --> 00:45:00,619
which may or may not have ties to nukes

1048
00:45:05,620 --> 00:45:04,160
I don't know it's an interesting book I

1049
00:45:07,180 --> 00:45:05,630
have no just read it recently and I

1050
00:45:11,019 --> 00:45:07,190
detect by coincidence elsewhere and

1051
00:45:12,279 --> 00:45:11,029
Leslie Keens book an excellent book you

1052
00:45:14,859 --> 00:45:12,289
haven't had her on for quite some time

1053
00:45:18,999 --> 00:45:14,869
what has she been up to you know she did

1054
00:45:22,870 --> 00:45:19,009
a book on psychic phenomena very if you

1055
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:22,880
remember we had her on again I'm going

1056
00:45:27,670 --> 00:45:24,650
to have to look up the specific dates

1057
00:45:31,049 --> 00:45:27,680
because after five or six hard shows

1058
00:45:34,990 --> 00:45:31,059
they blur in your mind and we had her on

1059
00:45:36,819 --> 00:45:35,000
with Erica Luke's on March 12th and the

1060
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:36,829
book is called surviving death a

1061
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:40,010
journalist investigates evidence for an

1062
00:45:44,470 --> 00:45:42,410
afterlife the other thing I would say is

1063
00:45:46,930 --> 00:45:44,480
I like Leslie I just think the title is

1064
00:45:51,099 --> 00:45:46,940
pretentious it's something special I am

1065
00:45:54,609 --> 00:45:51,109
a journalist okay I just thought the

1066
00:45:56,349 --> 00:45:54,619
title was a little bit you know much we

1067
00:45:59,020 --> 00:45:56,359
also had her on like a couple of years

1068
00:46:04,480 --> 00:45:59,030
previous to that with Mark wrote a ger

1069
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:04,490
and this was with regard to something

1070
00:46:10,329 --> 00:46:06,650
called UFO DITA where they're gonna

1071
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:10,339
create a worldwide network of UFO

1072
00:46:16,089 --> 00:46:14,210
detectors it's two years ago and it

1073
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:16,099
doesn't look as if much was done about

1074
00:46:22,270 --> 00:46:18,770
it in fact I'm gonna look right now we

1075
00:46:25,059 --> 00:46:22,280
had them on November 2015 if you go to

1076
00:46:28,839 --> 00:46:25,069
the UFO Datanet site it's still there

1077
00:46:33,089 --> 00:46:28,849
and they're looking I guess for a crowd

1078
00:46:36,039 --> 00:46:33,099
funding source but as far as I can see

1079
00:46:38,859 --> 00:46:36,049
the last project update was almost a

1080
00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:38,869
year ago when is your book coming out

1081
00:46:46,750 --> 00:46:41,210
when is your book coming out gee what

1082
00:46:50,589 --> 00:46:46,760
book the one that you've been thinking

1083
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:50,599
about all these years well I haven't

1084
00:46:54,329 --> 00:46:52,970
been thinking about it that much except

1085
00:46:57,280 --> 00:46:54,339
that some people have suggested I take

1086
00:47:00,220 --> 00:46:57,290
the commentaries from the power cast

1087
00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:00,230
newsletter and compiled them into a book

1088
00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:02,569
I would like a third party to do that

1089
00:47:07,270 --> 00:47:03,890
I'm too close to some of the stories

1090
00:47:10,329 --> 00:47:07,280
some are repetitive I'm thinking here if

1091
00:47:14,950 --> 00:47:10,339
you can get together like 40 or 50 of

1092
00:47:17,980 --> 00:47:14,960
them together it would make a reasonable

1093
00:47:20,430 --> 00:47:17,990
size book and I'll leave that to a third

1094
00:47:23,740 --> 00:47:20,440
party if anyone's interested just

1095
00:47:26,140 --> 00:47:23,750
letting you know and take a look and

1096
00:47:28,809 --> 00:47:26,150
tell me what we'd like to see and we can

1097
00:47:31,329 --> 00:47:28,819
just assemble the columns give them a

1098
00:47:35,289 --> 00:47:31,339
final shave and haircut some updating

1099
00:47:38,170 --> 00:47:35,299
and come out with a book I'm gonna ask a

1100
00:47:40,660 --> 00:47:38,180
specific question although my guess is

1101
00:47:40,950 --> 00:47:40,670
there's no easy specific answer but I've

1102
00:47:44,490 --> 00:47:40,960
all

1103
00:47:47,190 --> 00:47:44,500
intrigued by the Bolender memo or he

1104
00:47:48,750 --> 00:47:47,200
says let me see reports of UFOs which

1105
00:47:50,670 --> 00:47:48,760
could affect national security will

1106
00:47:52,260 --> 00:47:50,680
continue to be handled to the standard

1107
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:52,270
air force procedures designed for this

1108
00:47:58,170 --> 00:47:55,330
purpose and then he recommends closing

1109
00:48:00,120 --> 00:47:58,180
down Blue Book and I'm sure is why no

1110
00:48:01,980 --> 00:48:00,130
one has really pushed that why has

1111
00:48:05,070 --> 00:48:01,990
nobody tried to find out what that means

1112
00:48:09,079 --> 00:48:05,080
and what is going on I mean he could

1113
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:09,089
just refer to really Soviets

1114
00:48:13,650 --> 00:48:11,770
experimental class but it could also be

1115
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:13,660
I mean the UFO community's nice one

1116
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:16,810
interpreted more broadly I'd really like

1117
00:48:24,570 --> 00:48:19,690
to know why that has been left to dangle

1118
00:48:30,300 --> 00:48:24,580
out there any thoughts Randall why

1119
00:48:33,720 --> 00:48:30,310
should take that oh well I tried to look

1120
00:48:35,430 --> 00:48:33,730
into that somewhat and it turns out that

1121
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:35,440
some of those reports from what I could

1122
00:48:40,349 --> 00:48:37,570
if I'm recalling this correctly were

1123
00:48:44,190 --> 00:48:40,359
sent off to the Office of Scientific

1124
00:48:47,070 --> 00:48:44,200
intelligence or investigation actually

1125
00:48:49,140 --> 00:48:47,080
and that was I think at that time part

1126
00:48:50,940 --> 00:48:49,150
of the CIA and they had a little office

1127
00:48:52,290 --> 00:48:50,950
that just really didn't want to be

1128
00:48:56,609 --> 00:48:52,300
involved with it because they had too

1129
00:48:59,490 --> 00:48:56,619
much other stuff to do so that was kind

1130
00:49:07,430 --> 00:48:59,500
of where the trail led me and I couldn't

1131
00:49:12,390 --> 00:49:10,140
that's that's about all that I know I

1132
00:49:14,339 --> 00:49:12,400
mean they take reports obviously they go

1133
00:49:17,070 --> 00:49:14,349
someplace somebody knows something but

1134
00:49:19,099 --> 00:49:17,080
we don't know exactly who the people are

1135
00:49:25,460 --> 00:49:19,109
that look at the information and decide

1136
00:49:32,130 --> 00:49:29,460
sorry to leave such a dead dead end but

1137
00:49:34,500 --> 00:49:32,140
it's something that really slaps one in

1138
00:49:39,450 --> 00:49:34,510
the face when one reads about it you

1139
00:49:41,250 --> 00:49:39,460
have to wonder what's going on well that

1140
00:49:43,349 --> 00:49:41,260
takes us back to what Jean was saying

1141
00:49:45,450 --> 00:49:43,359
it's the preponderance of the evidence I

1142
00:49:48,720 --> 00:49:45,460
mean there's so much of it out there

1143
00:49:49,589 --> 00:49:48,730
like do we really need to have the

1144
00:49:52,380 --> 00:49:49,599
powers-that-be

1145
00:49:54,089 --> 00:49:52,390
tell us what we already know is the

1146
00:49:54,900 --> 00:49:54,099
point that I like to make it I think

1147
00:49:56,510 --> 00:49:54,910
that there's enough

1148
00:50:00,240 --> 00:49:56,520
of us out here who already know that

1149
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:00,250
alien visitation is a reality we don't

1150
00:50:06,059 --> 00:50:02,410
really need the government or skeptics

1151
00:50:08,910 --> 00:50:06,069
or scientists to tell us that and you

1152
00:50:10,890 --> 00:50:08,920
know why the need for the verification

1153
00:50:12,599 --> 00:50:10,900
by them for us when such a large

1154
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:12,609
percentage of the population already

1155
00:50:18,059 --> 00:50:15,930
believes that that's the case

1156
00:50:19,980 --> 00:50:18,069
and so we're just waiting for them to

1157
00:50:23,309 --> 00:50:19,990
make the move to make themselves

1158
00:50:29,370 --> 00:50:23,319
accessible to us because we don't add

1159
00:50:32,010 --> 00:50:29,380
the ability to approach them well I

1160
00:50:35,329 --> 00:50:32,020
think that there are people who this is

1161
00:50:37,859 --> 00:50:35,339
they seem to need the validation they

1162
00:50:40,829 --> 00:50:37,869
they want people to believe them because

1163
00:50:45,359 --> 00:50:40,839
it's such a an incredible thing to them

1164
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:45,369
such as a change in worldview from a

1165
00:50:51,029 --> 00:50:48,010
view that doesn't include it that they

1166
00:50:54,750 --> 00:50:51,039
want to see other people validate their

1167
00:50:56,990 --> 00:50:54,760
belief so the focus is on getting some

1168
00:51:00,269 --> 00:50:57,000
sort of authority to do that

1169
00:51:03,059 --> 00:51:00,279
rather than simply accepting what we

1170
00:51:06,150 --> 00:51:03,069
know and trying to group together to in

1171
00:51:08,099 --> 00:51:06,160
a more United Way ourselves like this is

1172
00:51:10,230 --> 00:51:08,109
a problem that that maybe I don't know

1173
00:51:12,960 --> 00:51:10,240
you could provide an opinion on Lu what

1174
00:51:20,370 --> 00:51:12,970
why is it that there's so many of us I

1175
00:51:23,130 --> 00:51:20,380
do believe but our listener asking us

1176
00:51:27,260 --> 00:51:23,140
questions and engaging in discussions is

1177
00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:27,270
Louis Chien Jean and Randall Murphy

1178
00:51:35,090 --> 00:51:38,640
[Music]

1179
00:51:48,829 --> 00:51:42,620
you are listening to GCN

1180
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1227
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[Applause]

1228
00:54:04,530 --> 00:54:00,190
welcome back to the para cast the gold

1229
00:54:08,500 --> 00:54:04,540
standard of paranormal radio and now

1230
00:54:11,810 --> 00:54:08,510
here's Jane Steinberg

1231
00:54:17,550 --> 00:54:15,480
let's continue we invited Louis Sheehan

1232
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:17,560
amongst other listeners to come on the

1233
00:54:21,839 --> 00:54:19,810
power cast and see what happens what

1234
00:54:23,910 --> 00:54:21,849
happens is a very engaging discussion

1235
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:23,920
guys you weren't about to get into it

1236
00:54:27,750 --> 00:54:25,570
with each other on some topics go ahead

1237
00:54:29,190 --> 00:54:27,760
no actually I want to compliment him

1238
00:54:31,470 --> 00:54:29,200
that's an interesting fun and I'm sorry

1239
00:54:33,089 --> 00:54:31,480
if I spoke over Eugene you know I guess

1240
00:54:35,460 --> 00:54:33,099
I have been wanting some sort of

1241
00:54:37,470 --> 00:54:35,470
validation but in fact it's not

1242
00:54:38,700 --> 00:54:37,480
necessary it's just a question of

1243
00:54:39,690 --> 00:54:38,710
waiting for them to make themselves

1244
00:54:41,370 --> 00:54:39,700
accessible

1245
00:54:43,319 --> 00:54:41,380
I guess that's basically the point

1246
00:54:45,660 --> 00:54:43,329
because even if the government were to

1247
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:45,670
say yes they are they're there and that

1248
00:54:49,770 --> 00:54:47,530
what would that really change it

1249
00:54:52,829 --> 00:54:49,780
wouldn't change much would it other than

1250
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:52,839
us being astounded by their honesty for

1251
00:54:56,640 --> 00:54:54,490
a change other than that I guess not

1252
00:54:58,079 --> 00:54:56,650
much would really change well I don't

1253
00:55:00,329 --> 00:54:58,089
think that people would even believe

1254
00:55:01,829 --> 00:55:00,339
them anyhow that I mean how many people

1255
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:01,839
believe everything the government tells

1256
00:55:05,069 --> 00:55:02,650
us anyway

1257
00:55:07,410 --> 00:55:05,079
so at how much validation would we

1258
00:55:10,200 --> 00:55:07,420
really get we would need something

1259
00:55:14,339 --> 00:55:10,210
really definitive we'd need pictures

1260
00:55:18,540 --> 00:55:14,349
from the Mars rover or some space probe

1261
00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:18,550
of another craft or the remnants or of a

1262
00:55:23,550 --> 00:55:20,410
city on another planet or something like

1263
00:55:25,890 --> 00:55:23,560
that that are indisputable really and

1264
00:55:27,450 --> 00:55:25,900
even then there would be skeptics and

1265
00:55:31,710 --> 00:55:27,460
people still don't believe we've been to

1266
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:31,720
the moon some of them okay so yeah good

1267
00:55:38,819 --> 00:55:35,410
points very good points Jean your

1268
00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:38,829
thoughts one somebody has an ironclad

1269
00:55:44,670 --> 00:55:41,650
opinion about anything changing that

1270
00:55:49,020 --> 00:55:44,680
opinion is just impossible they're gonna

1271
00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:49,030
stick to it to be about politics could

1272
00:55:53,190 --> 00:55:50,650
be about anything and only a small

1273
00:55:54,750 --> 00:55:53,200
number we'll look at possibilities and

1274
00:55:57,450 --> 00:55:54,760
when they do it's probably because they

1275
00:56:00,900 --> 00:55:57,460
don't have a final opinion on something

1276
00:56:03,210 --> 00:56:00,910
so amongst all you people here

1277
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:03,220
I don't know that UFOs or spaceships

1278
00:56:07,589 --> 00:56:05,890
maybe they are it could be something

1279
00:56:11,250 --> 00:56:07,599
else that could be an interaction

1280
00:56:14,430 --> 00:56:11,260
between us and our environment that is

1281
00:56:18,300 --> 00:56:14,440
culturally dependent so I know that's a

1282
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:18,310
ongoing discussion but not not taking an

1283
00:56:21,329 --> 00:56:20,050
ironclad opinion because when you look

1284
00:56:24,329 --> 00:56:21,339
through strange thing

1285
00:56:26,579 --> 00:56:24,339
being seen the skies over the centuries

1286
00:56:29,969 --> 00:56:26,589
you have to wonder what's going on and

1287
00:56:33,089 --> 00:56:29,979
whether our point of view is close

1288
00:56:35,370 --> 00:56:33,099
enough to the truth or is being overly

1289
00:56:37,380 --> 00:56:35,380
simplistic or we're just interpreting it

1290
00:56:39,660 --> 00:56:37,390
in our current understanding we live in

1291
00:56:41,339 --> 00:56:39,670
the Star Trek universe therefore the

1292
00:56:45,420 --> 00:56:41,349
things we see in the sky on the ground

1293
00:56:47,339 --> 00:56:45,430
whatever ARA manifested that way and if

1294
00:56:53,489 --> 00:56:47,349
something else takes over 50 years from

1295
00:56:56,130 --> 00:56:53,499
now ufos will be that well like Vallet

1296
00:56:58,229 --> 00:56:56,140
said and when him his books i believe he

1297
00:57:00,630 --> 00:56:58,239
says that he didn't think that there was

1298
00:57:03,420 --> 00:57:00,640
anything more treacherous than the term

1299
00:57:05,489 --> 00:57:03,430
unidentified and so it really boils down

1300
00:57:08,009 --> 00:57:05,499
to how we look at what the phenomena

1301
00:57:11,729 --> 00:57:08,019
represents what we mean by the word

1302
00:57:14,039 --> 00:57:11,739
itself so what we have is a discussion

1303
00:57:16,140 --> 00:57:14,049
that involves sort of a fudging around

1304
00:57:17,910 --> 00:57:16,150
of people's views about what it means in

1305
00:57:21,420 --> 00:57:17,920
order to substantiate whatever their

1306
00:57:22,650 --> 00:57:21,430
belief system is and i prefer to go back

1307
00:57:24,809 --> 00:57:22,660
and try to look at the historical

1308
00:57:26,940 --> 00:57:24,819
evidence for the development of the the

1309
00:57:29,430 --> 00:57:26,950
word and the meanings and and what it

1310
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:29,440
comes down to in terms of ufology is a

1311
00:57:35,359 --> 00:57:32,170
field of study as opposed to sort of a

1312
00:57:37,979 --> 00:57:35,369
personal preference or belief system and

1313
00:57:39,989 --> 00:57:37,989
when we go that route then we're only

1314
00:57:43,109 --> 00:57:39,999
left with a certain number of

1315
00:57:45,959 --> 00:57:43,119
possibilities and that boils down to

1316
00:57:48,569 --> 00:57:45,969
some sort of alien craft in terms of

1317
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:48,579
what we mean so gene while you're

1318
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:50,890
absolutely right that there could be a

1319
00:57:55,559 --> 00:57:52,930
number of explanations for the phenomena

1320
00:57:58,339 --> 00:57:55,569
that's reported in UFO reports that

1321
00:58:02,400 --> 00:57:58,349
doesn't mean that what's in the reports

1322
00:58:04,739 --> 00:58:02,410
necessarily is of a UFO or an alien

1323
00:58:06,209 --> 00:58:04,749
craft and I think there's a lot of

1324
00:58:08,789 --> 00:58:06,219
confusion about that so that's why

1325
00:58:10,620 --> 00:58:08,799
people in the media will say oh a UFO

1326
00:58:12,469 --> 00:58:10,630
well that just means an unidentified

1327
00:58:15,450 --> 00:58:12,479
flying object literally but that's

1328
00:58:17,640 --> 00:58:15,460
really far from the actual definition

1329
00:58:18,839 --> 00:58:17,650
that the Air Force itself came up with

1330
00:58:21,479 --> 00:58:18,849
and they're the ones who develop the

1331
00:58:23,400 --> 00:58:21,489
term so we're kind of misled into this

1332
00:58:27,029 --> 00:58:23,410
idea that well UFOs could be anything

1333
00:58:28,650 --> 00:58:27,039
but really that's not the case so you

1334
00:58:31,289 --> 00:58:28,660
have a different view of the meaning of

1335
00:58:33,779 --> 00:58:31,299
UFO well I wouldn't say I have a

1336
00:58:37,620 --> 00:58:33,789
different view but you know it was aimed

1337
00:58:39,479 --> 00:58:37,630
by Edward ruppelt and he described the

1338
00:58:42,959 --> 00:58:39,489
process in his book the report on

1339
00:58:46,709 --> 00:58:42,969
unidentified flying objects right and I

1340
00:58:49,410 --> 00:58:46,719
don't see him assuming that a UFO must

1341
00:58:51,359 --> 00:58:49,420
be a spaceship well that's the whole

1342
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:51,369
thing you see they they couldn't just

1343
00:58:56,910 --> 00:58:53,650
come out and say that and he knew that

1344
00:58:59,969 --> 00:58:56,920
and so what they did is they they evolve

1345
00:59:05,039 --> 00:58:59,979
the definition for reporting over a

1346
00:59:07,559 --> 00:59:05,049
number of iterations in order to sift it

1347
00:59:09,839 --> 00:59:07,569
down and distill out from the overall

1348
00:59:11,700 --> 00:59:09,849
reports the very specific types of

1349
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:11,710
phenomena that they're looking for and

1350
00:59:17,130 --> 00:59:13,930
when you do that you get into something

1351
00:59:20,670 --> 00:59:17,140
like Air Force regulation 202 from

1352
00:59:22,799 --> 00:59:20,680
February 5th 1958 and that goes into it

1353
00:59:27,180 --> 00:59:22,809
in quite some detail and it really

1354
00:59:29,069 --> 00:59:27,190
leaves no uncertainty about what it is

1355
00:59:31,219 --> 00:59:29,079
they're looking for they're saying that

1356
00:59:34,519 --> 00:59:31,229
they're looking for everything else but

1357
00:59:38,039 --> 00:59:34,529
natural known man-made objects even

1358
00:59:39,930 --> 00:59:38,049
secret projects and even the possibility

1359
00:59:42,029 --> 00:59:39,940
of things that could be secret projects

1360
00:59:44,039 --> 00:59:42,039
or secret aircraft those are excluded

1361
00:59:47,099 --> 00:59:44,049
from the official definition of UFO in

1362
00:59:49,859 --> 00:59:47,109
that regulation so you know what are we

1363
00:59:53,549 --> 00:59:49,869
supposed to see as being left over other

1364
00:59:54,930 --> 00:59:53,559
than some sort of alien craft no they've

1365
00:59:58,019 --> 00:59:54,940
done everything but just come out and

1366
01:00:01,349 --> 00:59:58,029
say it well I think you can look at it

1367
01:00:04,529 --> 01:00:01,359
that way you can also look at it as this

1368
01:00:06,329 --> 01:00:04,539
is a way to accommodate all possible

1369
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:06,339
explanations for UFOs

1370
01:00:10,519 --> 01:00:08,410
because there isn't a category called

1371
01:00:14,940 --> 01:00:10,529
spaceships as a category called unknown

1372
01:00:17,609 --> 01:00:14,950
if after you do the investigation you

1373
01:00:19,019 --> 01:00:17,619
can't find a suitable answer you call it

1374
01:00:21,390 --> 01:00:19,029
unknown you don't call it spaceship

1375
01:00:24,359 --> 01:00:21,400
there's no category called spaceship you

1376
01:00:27,479 --> 01:00:24,369
can say unknown must be spaceship but

1377
01:00:29,700 --> 01:00:27,489
that also is debatable they wanted to

1378
01:00:32,370 --> 01:00:29,710
avoid that and of course spaceship well

1379
01:00:34,529 --> 01:00:32,380
that that's a more specific term I mean

1380
01:00:37,670 --> 01:00:34,539
if we call it alien that doesn't

1381
01:00:39,750 --> 01:00:37,680
necessitate anything that's

1382
01:00:42,810 --> 01:00:39,760
extraterrestrial the interstellar

1383
01:00:44,580 --> 01:00:42,820
hypothesis is reasonable but we can't be

1384
01:00:46,650 --> 01:00:44,590
sure that that's the case with what we

1385
01:00:49,470 --> 01:00:46,660
know out here in the public but what we

1386
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:49,480
can say is that the definitions were

1387
01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:52,690
designed in such a way to eliminate

1388
01:00:57,600 --> 01:00:55,570
anything but something that was really a

1389
01:01:00,960 --> 01:00:57,610
lien because that is what they were

1390
01:01:02,490 --> 01:01:00,970
looking for and I mean we could get very

1391
01:01:06,090 --> 01:01:02,500
specific here in terms of the

1392
01:01:07,710 --> 01:01:06,100
definitions if we wanted to but that's

1393
01:01:09,690 --> 01:01:07,720
really I guess people just have to take

1394
01:01:11,550 --> 01:01:09,700
my word for it or go to the usi site and

1395
01:01:13,560 --> 01:01:11,560
look it up because I did quite extensive

1396
01:01:15,060 --> 01:01:13,570
research on the origin of the word where

1397
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:15,070
it comes from and how that definition

1398
01:01:20,250 --> 01:01:18,130
evolved and so that's how it it comes

1399
01:01:23,100 --> 01:01:20,260
down in terms of ufology is the field of

1400
01:01:25,380 --> 01:01:23,110
study but to the average person they

1401
01:01:27,359 --> 01:01:25,390
don't think of it that way it sort of

1402
01:01:29,130 --> 01:01:27,369
really gets muddy and murky and I think

1403
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:29,140
that it's responsible for a lot of

1404
01:01:36,210 --> 01:01:31,810
confusion the average person when you

1405
01:01:39,030 --> 01:01:36,220
say UFO they do think spaceship yeah

1406
01:01:41,390 --> 01:01:39,040
yeah definitely I think it implies

1407
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:41,400
spaceship but it doesn't necessitate

1408
01:01:46,260 --> 01:01:43,690
spaceship and I think that's reasonable

1409
01:01:48,540 --> 01:01:46,270
because as I was saying the interstellar

1410
01:01:50,910 --> 01:01:48,550
hypothesis is a reasonable hypothesis

1411
01:01:54,630 --> 01:01:50,920
but it yeah but the thing yet they're

1412
01:01:57,210 --> 01:01:54,640
mine randall is this we're looking at

1413
01:02:01,080 --> 01:01:57,220
ufos when that term was coined from an

1414
01:02:03,900 --> 01:02:01,090
early 50's perspective where you have

1415
01:02:06,630 --> 01:02:03,910
all possibilities of conventional

1416
01:02:08,550 --> 01:02:06,640
objects and phenomena and the only thing

1417
01:02:11,849 --> 01:02:08,560
left to them was the spaceship

1418
01:02:14,580 --> 01:02:11,859
explanation nothing else was involved

1419
01:02:16,770 --> 01:02:14,590
nothing else was considered therefore

1420
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:16,780
unknown became the equivalent of a

1421
01:02:21,300 --> 01:02:18,970
spaceship because probably in the point

1422
01:02:23,700 --> 01:02:21,310
of view of those who created that

1423
01:02:26,070 --> 01:02:23,710
terminology and the project headed by

1424
01:02:28,080 --> 01:02:26,080
captain rappelled we're that that's what

1425
01:02:30,450 --> 01:02:28,090
you were talking about either it's all

1426
01:02:33,510 --> 01:02:30,460
these other things or it's spaceships

1427
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:33,520
there's no other conclusion and if

1428
01:02:38,820 --> 01:02:35,890
anything that if you take it that way

1429
01:02:40,050 --> 01:02:38,830
that the UFO and the end must be a

1430
01:02:42,420 --> 01:02:40,060
spaceship if there's no other

1431
01:02:45,720 --> 01:02:42,430
explanation that's because the

1432
01:02:46,710 --> 01:02:45,730
definition is limited it doesn't take

1433
01:02:49,650 --> 01:02:46,720
into account

1434
01:02:50,750 --> 01:02:49,660
interdimensional craft collective

1435
01:02:53,900 --> 01:02:50,760
unconscious

1436
01:02:57,220 --> 01:02:53,910
any of this other stuff it doesn't take

1437
01:03:00,080 --> 01:02:57,230
into it it wasn't even on their radar

1438
01:03:01,690 --> 01:03:00,090
well they did consider the psychological

1439
01:03:03,830 --> 01:03:01,700
state of the witnesses when they were

1440
01:03:05,270 --> 01:03:03,840
interviewed right so you see in those

1441
01:03:08,420 --> 01:03:05,280
cases they're looking for people who

1442
01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:08,430
might be a little crazy the

1443
01:03:14,060 --> 01:03:10,170
psychological state is well this

1444
01:03:17,540 --> 01:03:14,070
person's crazy they're seeing things you

1445
01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:17,550
see but well yeah exactly but in a sense

1446
01:03:22,370 --> 01:03:19,410
this is exactly why there's so much

1447
01:03:25,250 --> 01:03:22,380
confusion well we'll go into this

1448
01:03:27,290 --> 01:03:25,260
argument this argument over the meaning

1449
01:03:29,750 --> 01:03:27,300
of UFOs or whether it even makes a

1450
01:03:33,020 --> 01:03:29,760
difference Lucian was all of our

1451
01:03:35,630 --> 01:03:33,030
listeners who is kind of becoming the

1452
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:35,640
questioner of Jeanne and Randall you're

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1556
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that's news at the para cast calm and

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1559
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para cast comm so as we look this over

1560
01:08:20,930 --> 01:08:17,070
Randall Murphy Lucian we can debate to

1561
01:08:23,300 --> 01:08:20,940
the end of time the significance of the

1562
01:08:26,630 --> 01:08:23,310
term UFO but I'm just saying to the

1563
01:08:29,690 --> 01:08:26,640
people involved like Edward repelled

1564
01:08:33,470 --> 01:08:29,700
it was either conventional or spaceship

1565
01:08:35,210 --> 01:08:33,480
there was no third option conventional

1566
01:08:36,770 --> 01:08:35,220
being conventional objects or phenomena

1567
01:08:38,660 --> 01:08:36,780
which could include people with

1568
01:08:41,500 --> 01:08:38,670
psychological difficulties people seeing

1569
01:08:46,550 --> 01:08:41,510
things people having delusions or

1570
01:08:49,850 --> 01:08:46,560
spaceships that was it now we could look

1571
01:08:52,040 --> 01:08:49,860
at UFOs today and say it's something we

1572
01:08:54,260 --> 01:08:52,050
haven't figured out yet we can expand

1573
01:08:57,140 --> 01:08:54,270
the definition if you look at it the way

1574
01:08:58,580 --> 01:08:57,150
you're looking at it Randall yeah it's

1575
01:09:00,170 --> 01:08:58,590
spaceships because the people who

1576
01:09:03,110 --> 01:09:00,180
created the term didn't have any other

1577
01:09:04,790 --> 01:09:03,120
framework preference well actually what

1578
01:09:07,220 --> 01:09:04,800
they were saying is that it's likely

1579
01:09:08,540 --> 01:09:07,230
that they're interplanetary they didn't

1580
01:09:10,910 --> 01:09:08,550
say for certain that they're

1581
01:09:12,710 --> 01:09:10,920
interplanetary what it boils down to is

1582
01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:12,720
that it's still something alien it was

1583
01:09:17,750 --> 01:09:14,850
outside of anything that they know how

1584
01:09:20,990 --> 01:09:17,760
to explain in terms of any current

1585
01:09:23,660 --> 01:09:21,000
knowledge that we have so the term alien

1586
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:23,670
I think is a lot more apropos than

1587
01:09:29,560 --> 01:09:26,850
saying extraterrestrial and this is how

1588
01:09:33,380 --> 01:09:29,570
at least this is how we define it here

1589
01:09:36,170 --> 01:09:33,390
in u.s. I in terms of ufology is a field

1590
01:09:38,620 --> 01:09:36,180
of study sure it might be that there's

1591
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:38,630
phenomena that's caused by some natural

1592
01:09:42,530 --> 01:09:40,890
maybe some sort of creature that we

1593
01:09:44,620 --> 01:09:42,540
don't know let's suppose that's flying

1594
01:09:47,840 --> 01:09:44,630
around but that gets into something like

1595
01:09:49,670 --> 01:09:47,850
cryptozoology it's not ufology it's

1596
01:09:53,060 --> 01:09:49,680
something else so what we're looking for

1597
01:09:56,180 --> 01:09:53,070
specifically is some sort of an alien

1598
01:09:58,060 --> 01:09:56,190
craft and that's how it's defined at

1599
01:10:00,730 --> 01:09:58,070
least to the best of

1600
01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:00,740
my research in a historical sense which

1601
01:10:05,110 --> 01:10:02,810
is far more objective than simply what I

1602
01:10:07,180 --> 01:10:05,120
want to believe so this is what we're

1603
01:10:10,180 --> 01:10:07,190
left with to your point of view Randall

1604
01:10:12,130 --> 01:10:10,190
yes but I'm not looking for a spaceship

1605
01:10:14,080 --> 01:10:12,140
I'm looking for the answer well if the

1606
01:10:15,970 --> 01:10:14,090
answer is a spaceship cool that's fine

1607
01:10:18,970 --> 01:10:15,980
if the answer is something else I'm

1608
01:10:21,600 --> 01:10:18,980
looking for that too so if when you look

1609
01:10:24,400 --> 01:10:21,610
at a spaceship by God you might find one

1610
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:24,410
maybe that's just like if you look for a

1611
01:10:28,180 --> 01:10:26,330
black hole you might find one but at the

1612
01:10:30,610 --> 01:10:28,190
beginning people have to have some idea

1613
01:10:32,110 --> 01:10:30,620
about what it is they're looking for and

1614
01:10:34,720 --> 01:10:32,120
what they mean by that in order to

1615
01:10:36,970 --> 01:10:34,730
advance their study of whatever it is

1616
01:10:39,160 --> 01:10:36,980
that they're trying to figure out so

1617
01:10:43,260 --> 01:10:39,170
that's the that's the case that I make

1618
01:10:45,070 --> 01:10:43,270
is if we just make it so broaden and

1619
01:10:47,410 --> 01:10:45,080
nebulous that we don't know what we're

1620
01:10:51,100 --> 01:10:47,420
talking about anymore the field itself

1621
01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:51,110
loses focus and so we really do need

1622
01:10:56,410 --> 01:10:53,810
something that narrows down what it is

1623
01:10:58,060 --> 01:10:56,420
we're talking about in a concrete way so

1624
01:11:02,170 --> 01:10:58,070
I do that from a historical perspective

1625
01:11:03,490 --> 01:11:02,180
in a subjective way as I can in order to

1626
01:11:05,530 --> 01:11:03,500
make it clear what it is we're looking

1627
01:11:08,110 --> 01:11:05,540
for and again you know I'm not saying

1628
01:11:12,160 --> 01:11:08,120
spaceship I'm saying that's a reasonable

1629
01:11:15,430 --> 01:11:12,170
hypothesis but it may not be the actual

1630
01:11:17,620 --> 01:11:15,440
answer I think we don't need to debate

1631
01:11:20,020 --> 01:11:17,630
the terminology I don't think it takes

1632
01:11:22,210 --> 01:11:20,030
us anywhere it doesn't solve anything

1633
01:11:25,690 --> 01:11:22,220
does UFOs accommodate all this other

1634
01:11:28,030 --> 01:11:25,700
stuff what were they thinking in 1953

1635
01:11:30,970 --> 01:11:28,040
when they were looking at UFOs about the

1636
01:11:32,860 --> 01:11:30,980
possible answers now with Captain

1637
01:11:34,240 --> 01:11:32,870
rappelled it was kind of strange because

1638
01:11:36,190 --> 01:11:34,250
you got the impression from the first

1639
01:11:38,470 --> 01:11:36,200
part of the book the original book that

1640
01:11:42,340 --> 01:11:38,480
he believed they were spaceships because

1641
01:11:44,530 --> 01:11:42,350
it got to that impression and then when

1642
01:11:47,110 --> 01:11:44,540
he did the three chapters before his

1643
01:11:49,720 --> 01:11:47,120
death he said no I'm positive they don't

1644
01:11:53,770 --> 01:11:49,730
use that phrase I'm positive they don't

1645
01:11:57,630 --> 01:11:53,780
in terms of UFOs being real

1646
01:12:01,330 --> 01:11:57,640
he felt then he decided well it was just

1647
01:12:02,740 --> 01:12:01,340
conventional stuff and it sounded to

1648
01:12:05,950 --> 01:12:02,750
some people that he didn't even write

1649
01:12:08,380 --> 01:12:05,960
those last three chapters but to me I

1650
01:12:11,110 --> 01:12:08,390
think it was within the same writing

1651
01:12:14,170 --> 01:12:11,120
style in fact what reminded me of that

1652
01:12:18,400 --> 01:12:14,180
that the original report on unidentified

1653
01:12:20,730 --> 01:12:18,410
flying objects was written very much the

1654
01:12:23,970 --> 01:12:20,740
way key I would write a book

1655
01:12:26,670 --> 01:12:23,980
yeah well knew each other at the time I

1656
01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:26,680
remember a section of one of Chios books

1657
01:12:35,620 --> 01:12:31,210
where he went into great detail about

1658
01:12:38,110 --> 01:12:35,630
repels concerns over the pressure he was

1659
01:12:40,780 --> 01:12:38,120
confronting about that book that the

1660
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:40,790
book was to positive about UFOs and he

1661
01:12:46,450 --> 01:12:43,010
felt I guess that he was forced into

1662
01:12:48,400 --> 01:12:46,460
writing those last three chapters yeah

1663
01:12:50,440 --> 01:12:48,410
and it may that may have been the case

1664
01:12:52,830 --> 01:12:50,450
that there was some pressure on him to

1665
01:12:55,000 --> 01:12:52,840
sort of abide by the Condon report

1666
01:12:57,400 --> 01:12:55,010
recommendations in the Robertson panel

1667
01:13:00,340 --> 01:12:57,410
write what the Condon report wasn't out

1668
01:13:02,710 --> 01:13:00,350
when repeal was alive yeah

1669
01:13:05,950 --> 01:13:02,720
Roubaix in the nineteen fifties at the

1670
01:13:08,110 --> 01:13:05,960
in his late 30s of a heart condition he

1671
01:13:10,780 --> 01:13:08,120
died very shortly after he wrote those

1672
01:13:13,570 --> 01:13:10,790
three chapters right I won't say that he

1673
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:13,580
died because of the pressure of writing

1674
01:13:18,130 --> 01:13:15,650
those chapters probably because he had a

1675
01:13:22,360 --> 01:13:18,140
heart condition and something today we

1676
01:13:26,200 --> 01:13:22,370
deal with without as much trouble but

1677
01:13:29,230 --> 01:13:26,210
not in the 1950s so yeah but he was

1678
01:13:31,090 --> 01:13:29,240
basically responding to what was

1679
01:13:34,000 --> 01:13:31,100
happening at the time and remember a

1680
01:13:37,270 --> 01:13:34,010
rappelled also wanted to make a mark in

1681
01:13:40,090 --> 01:13:37,280
private industry make a living that kind

1682
01:13:42,310 --> 01:13:40,100
of thing and maybe this helped he

1683
01:13:44,260 --> 01:13:42,320
thought to improve his standing okay

1684
01:13:46,710 --> 01:13:44,270
he's not the UFO guy he didn't believe

1685
01:13:52,990 --> 01:13:46,720
it he maybe he'll get a job somewhere

1686
01:13:56,670 --> 01:13:53,000
that's my suspicion you know I was

1687
01:14:00,610 --> 01:13:56,680
thinking if I may say something

1688
01:14:03,280 --> 01:14:00,620
Stan Friedman is not a young pup anymore

1689
01:14:05,820 --> 01:14:03,290
you may want to get him on and get some

1690
01:14:08,970 --> 01:14:05,830
people really prepared to grill him and

1691
01:14:14,340 --> 01:14:08,980
let him defend himself pretty

1692
01:14:18,940 --> 01:14:14,350
contentious forum you're volunteering I

1693
01:14:22,270 --> 01:14:18,950
am and if we were set up like that I

1694
01:14:23,740 --> 01:14:22,280
would read his books I'm a fan so I

1695
01:14:24,729 --> 01:14:23,750
would hopefully I would be polite about

1696
01:14:27,310 --> 01:14:24,739
it

1697
01:14:28,839 --> 01:14:27,320
but as you're aware there's a lot of

1698
01:14:32,290 --> 01:14:28,849
skepticism about Roswell

1699
01:14:36,790 --> 01:14:32,300
maybe we should really put stand to the

1700
01:14:38,680 --> 01:14:36,800
test and let listeners decide but Stan

1701
01:14:41,770 --> 01:14:38,690
is a wealth of information much of it

1702
01:14:44,169 --> 01:14:41,780
unpublished for example there's Blue

1703
01:14:45,399 --> 01:14:44,179
Book I believe it's one through 12 that

1704
01:14:51,790 --> 01:14:45,409
was released to the public

1705
01:14:54,310 --> 01:14:51,800
there's a missing blue book 13 vol 13

1706
01:14:56,200 --> 01:14:54,320
that no one has been able to find the

1707
01:14:58,989 --> 01:14:56,210
official explanation seems to be Wayne

1708
01:15:02,049 --> 01:14:58,999
quaint not nobody likes the number 13

1709
01:15:04,239 --> 01:15:02,059
but stan has told me that he has heard

1710
01:15:05,529 --> 01:15:04,249
from more than one source that it exists

1711
01:15:06,129 --> 01:15:05,539
and it has not been released to the

1712
01:15:08,259 --> 01:15:06,139
public

1713
01:15:10,450 --> 01:15:08,269
little little tidbits like that I think

1714
01:15:13,470 --> 01:15:10,460
would really enrich the field to have

1715
01:15:15,879 --> 01:15:13,480
that saponin record but getting back to

1716
01:15:16,479 --> 01:15:15,889
grilling stand again it's not getting

1717
01:15:18,129 --> 01:15:16,489
any younger

1718
01:15:21,069 --> 01:15:18,139
that would might be a pretty good thing

1719
01:15:23,919 --> 01:15:21,079
I don't understand and I wish Chris were

1720
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:23,929
here why ray Stanford has not put out a

1721
01:15:28,959 --> 01:15:27,530
book and maybe you guys will be able to

1722
01:15:30,759 --> 01:15:28,969
address that in another another

1723
01:15:33,540 --> 01:15:30,769
installment of your show and Chris has

1724
01:15:37,359 --> 01:15:33,550
done a rave back on I would like to know

1725
01:15:41,529 --> 01:15:37,369
why he's so reserved and putting out

1726
01:15:43,029 --> 01:15:41,539
information those are some suggested

1727
01:15:45,399 --> 01:15:43,039
topics for you in the future

1728
01:15:51,189 --> 01:15:45,409
well we've covered that in term we've

1729
01:15:54,430 --> 01:15:51,199
asked ray about that good what was his

1730
01:15:56,140 --> 01:15:54,440
answer then well he's not ready yet you

1731
01:15:58,629 --> 01:15:56,150
know when he's ready he'll publicize

1732
01:16:02,200 --> 01:15:58,639
that problem is here is that here's

1733
01:16:03,790 --> 01:16:02,210
somebody who has had heart problems he's

1734
01:16:06,790 --> 01:16:03,800
in his late seventies I'd have to look

1735
01:16:10,509 --> 01:16:06,800
up his age at and there is a point here

1736
01:16:12,399 --> 01:16:10,519
where you better do it or yeah I fear

1737
01:16:14,109 --> 01:16:12,409
you may not be around to do it and we

1738
01:16:16,720 --> 01:16:14,119
don't know he may live another 20 years

1739
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:16,730
and do fine but we don't know what we do

1740
01:16:22,899 --> 01:16:19,610
know is that we've got another half of a

1741
01:16:25,299 --> 01:16:22,909
show to do Raleigh partway there Lewis

1742
01:16:28,359 --> 01:16:25,309
Chien is one of our listeners serving as

1743
01:16:34,900 --> 01:16:28,369
a questioner a panelist with Jeana

1744
01:16:34,910 --> 01:16:39,550
[Music]

1745
01:16:47,200 --> 01:16:43,490
thank you for listening to GCN

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be sure to visit GCN live.com today

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1854
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1855
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1856
01:20:57,140 --> 01:20:55,590
james fox from chasing UFOs you're

1857
01:21:02,959 --> 01:20:57,150
listening to the podcast

1858
01:21:07,859 --> 01:21:05,459
now I should remind you again we have a

1859
01:21:10,890 --> 01:21:07,869
second radio show after the power cast

1860
01:21:12,120 --> 01:21:10,900
and it's unpredictable we never know

1861
01:21:13,740 --> 01:21:12,130
from week to week what we're going to do

1862
01:21:17,760 --> 01:21:13,750
it gotta finish an interview or do other

1863
01:21:20,970 --> 01:21:17,770
stuff if you want to listen to that show

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and download the show every week like

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coming and you get the commercial free

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01:21:46,140 --> 01:21:42,880
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1874
01:21:47,640 --> 01:21:46,150
Lewis Chien in someone who has been a

1875
01:21:49,740 --> 01:21:47,650
regular listener to the show and

1876
01:21:53,100 --> 01:21:49,750
participate in our forums and we had a

1877
01:21:55,709 --> 01:21:53,110
roundtable offer and he volunteered he

1878
01:21:59,189 --> 01:21:55,719
stuck his neck out and he's in the thick

1879
01:22:02,189 --> 01:21:59,199
of it right now right yeah I'm prepared

1880
01:22:03,660 --> 01:22:02,199
you might add if I fill out some time if

1881
01:22:05,669 --> 01:22:03,670
I don't advance I would have been much

1882
01:22:07,649 --> 01:22:05,679
better prepared but here's another

1883
01:22:10,050 --> 01:22:07,659
thought for you when you can when you

1884
01:22:11,910 --> 01:22:10,060
get Paul Kimball back on I know at least

1885
01:22:14,820 --> 01:22:11,920
in the in the past he's been a frequent

1886
01:22:18,149 --> 01:22:14,830
guest or a participant to ask him about

1887
01:22:20,430 --> 01:22:18,159
his movie is the top 10 sightings I

1888
01:22:22,050 --> 01:22:20,440
believe he said he's are trying his own

1889
01:22:24,780 --> 01:22:22,060
mind and I believe he's even published

1890
01:22:27,990 --> 01:22:24,790
somewhere some retractions as to some of

1891
01:22:30,510 --> 01:22:28,000
his the claims in his movie and I'd like

1892
01:22:33,750 --> 01:22:30,520
to have a more detailed explanation as

1893
01:22:35,340 --> 01:22:33,760
to what he's retracted and why so

1894
01:22:37,800 --> 01:22:35,350
there's another set of questions for

1895
01:22:40,379 --> 01:22:37,810
Eugene well let's just see Paul will be

1896
01:22:42,510 --> 01:22:40,389
back soon in fact he was on after the

1897
01:22:44,939 --> 01:22:42,520
power cast some weeks back so he'll be

1898
01:22:47,510 --> 01:22:44,949
back sooner we were actually going to

1899
01:22:50,040 --> 01:22:47,520
have him on last week or the week before

1900
01:22:52,979 --> 01:22:50,050
the episode we did with Greg Bishop and

1901
01:22:55,020 --> 01:22:52,989
Randall and Chris and I and it ended up

1902
01:22:57,840 --> 01:22:55,030
that he couldn't make it he had to do

1903
01:23:00,810 --> 01:22:57,850
something for his real life as opposed

1904
01:23:03,600 --> 01:23:00,820
to this life but I'm hoping that we'll

1905
01:23:05,490 --> 01:23:03,610
hear from him soon so he stays in touch

1906
01:23:09,959 --> 01:23:05,500
you know he participates in the forums

1907
01:23:13,140 --> 01:23:09,969
every so often he's doing another season

1908
01:23:14,910 --> 01:23:13,150
of that ghost show but he did some years

1909
01:23:18,240 --> 01:23:14,920
back a new version of it

1910
01:23:19,770 --> 01:23:18,250
so I'm sure he's going to want to get

1911
01:23:22,290 --> 01:23:19,780
the word out about haunted

1912
01:23:24,360 --> 01:23:22,300
he had a forum thread about it and it

1913
01:23:26,790 --> 01:23:24,370
was definitely definitely a thousand

1914
01:23:29,400 --> 01:23:26,800
percent Rebecca well I'm just again

1915
01:23:31,800 --> 01:23:29,410
prompting or urging you to ask him about

1916
01:23:34,380 --> 01:23:31,810
his movie and what it what Jesus has

1917
01:23:35,880 --> 01:23:34,390
have changed over time because I've

1918
01:23:40,020 --> 01:23:35,890
watched this movie several times enjoy

1919
01:23:42,750 --> 01:23:40,030
it greatly and it's free by the way it's

1920
01:23:45,690 --> 01:23:42,760
on YouTube for free I don't know if your

1921
01:23:47,250 --> 01:23:45,700
listeners know that but that's out there

1922
01:23:50,670 --> 01:23:47,260
for you

1923
01:23:52,170 --> 01:23:50,680
I want to hear more about your life and

1924
01:23:53,670 --> 01:23:52,180
what you've been doing these past couple

1925
01:23:54,450 --> 01:23:53,680
of decades other than running the

1926
01:23:56,610 --> 01:23:54,460
powertest

1927
01:23:59,190 --> 01:23:56,620
have you been making any individual

1928
01:24:01,830 --> 01:23:59,200
investigations or are you more the

1929
01:24:03,420 --> 01:24:01,840
reporter type I've always been the

1930
01:24:06,420 --> 01:24:03,430
reporter type because my background is

1931
01:24:09,840 --> 01:24:06,430
broadcast journalism so I have a

1932
01:24:12,630 --> 01:24:09,850
multiple history in UFO research I went

1933
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:12,640
straight through from the 50s to the mid

1934
01:24:18,750 --> 01:24:15,010
to late seventies and then I took a

1935
01:24:19,950 --> 01:24:18,760
hiatus for about a decade because I just

1936
01:24:21,570 --> 01:24:19,960
ran into a situation where I just

1937
01:24:24,320 --> 01:24:21,580
couldn't do it anymore and I had to earn

1938
01:24:27,000 --> 01:24:24,330
a living I was newly married and had to

1939
01:24:30,170 --> 01:24:27,010
do different things that took a lot of

1940
01:24:33,420 --> 01:24:30,180
my time and then my wife got involved

1941
01:24:36,690 --> 01:24:33,430
trying for a singing career and came

1942
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:36,700
very close and then our son was born so

1943
01:24:40,290 --> 01:24:38,170
we got really complicated in the late

1944
01:24:42,810 --> 01:24:40,300
80s I started drifting back into it off

1945
01:24:43,520 --> 01:24:42,820
and on put out a magazine for a few

1946
01:24:47,570 --> 01:24:43,530
years

1947
01:24:52,590 --> 01:24:47,580
watched the wheels go by and then in

1948
01:24:55,890 --> 01:24:52,600
2006 came the power cast that covers a

1949
01:24:58,890 --> 01:24:55,900
lot of it in which guests have you found

1950
01:25:01,710 --> 01:24:58,900
the most intriguing well you see that's

1951
01:25:04,470 --> 01:25:01,720
an interesting thing I just finished

1952
01:25:07,560 --> 01:25:04,480
putting up nearly 400 episodes at the

1953
01:25:08,460 --> 01:25:07,570
power cast on YouTube and for much of

1954
01:25:10,980 --> 01:25:08,470
that I didn't air huh

1955
01:25:15,930 --> 01:25:10,990
I didn't have a very good internet

1956
01:25:19,290 --> 01:25:15,940
connection at the time so it took a

1957
01:25:20,520 --> 01:25:19,300
while but we're done with it now we

1958
01:25:24,180 --> 01:25:20,530
might start putting up the older

1959
01:25:26,010 --> 01:25:24,190
episodes from 2006 through 2010 that

1960
01:25:28,380 --> 01:25:26,020
will come later but when you're talking

1961
01:25:28,780 --> 01:25:28,390
about that many episodes we have a lot

1962
01:25:31,570 --> 01:25:28,790
of

1963
01:25:33,850 --> 01:25:31,580
very interesting guests I'm always

1964
01:25:34,420 --> 01:25:33,860
treasure the sessions we did with Jim

1965
01:25:37,180 --> 01:25:34,430
Mosely

1966
01:25:40,840 --> 01:25:37,190
Jim was on our first episode with Brad

1967
01:25:45,580 --> 01:25:40,850
Steiger and he came on every so often

1968
01:25:49,150 --> 01:25:45,590
and he was fascinating and then in terms

1969
01:25:51,910 --> 01:25:49,160
of guests dr. Jacques filet was

1970
01:25:54,160 --> 01:25:51,920
certainly one of our better guests we

1971
01:25:57,580 --> 01:25:54,170
actually had them on the show one more

1972
01:26:00,370 --> 01:25:57,590
time than you hear and this is kind of

1973
01:26:03,510 --> 01:26:00,380
weird we've mentioned before we did a

1974
01:26:06,300 --> 01:26:03,520
recording one hour first hour going well

1975
01:26:08,560 --> 01:26:06,310
something happens in the recording and

1976
01:26:12,940 --> 01:26:08,570
Jacques didn't have time to go on and

1977
01:26:15,010 --> 01:26:12,950
redo it so that show died without ever

1978
01:26:17,680 --> 01:26:15,020
being aired most of what he said though

1979
01:26:20,170 --> 01:26:17,690
was later disgusts we had back on the

1980
01:26:22,930 --> 01:26:20,180
power cast for an hour very recently for

1981
01:26:24,090 --> 01:26:22,940
a full session and Hillary join us later

1982
01:26:27,610 --> 01:26:24,100
this year

1983
01:26:30,520 --> 01:26:27,620
he was among my favorites now for

1984
01:26:31,960 --> 01:26:30,530
various reasons we had other guests over

1985
01:26:36,640 --> 01:26:31,970
the years I'm looking at the list right

1986
01:26:41,200 --> 01:26:36,650
now the full list and the reason is some

1987
01:26:48,700 --> 01:26:41,210
of those guests were not shall we say of

1988
01:26:50,770 --> 01:26:48,710
the most honest or accurate Sean David

1989
01:26:53,890 --> 01:26:50,780
Morton well Sean David Morton was

1990
01:26:56,140 --> 01:26:53,900
actually on the power cast I think in

1991
01:26:58,570 --> 01:26:56,150
our first year I'm gonna look right now

1992
01:27:03,550 --> 01:26:58,580
yeah very early very early I went back

1993
01:27:06,850 --> 01:27:03,560
to listen to the show for fun well he

1994
01:27:10,810 --> 01:27:06,860
was early he was yes he was on May 23rd

1995
01:27:14,470 --> 01:27:10,820
2006 we had him on for the full episode

1996
01:27:16,870 --> 01:27:14,480
which was 90 minutes then and then after

1997
01:27:18,970 --> 01:27:16,880
he was on we took apart what he said

1998
01:27:21,730 --> 01:27:18,980
because the problem with what he said is

1999
01:27:23,290 --> 01:27:21,740
most of it was nonsense he claimed to

2000
01:27:25,900 --> 01:27:23,300
know this that and the other thing he

2001
01:27:33,190 --> 01:27:25,910
claimed to be friends with various

2002
01:27:35,980 --> 01:27:33,200
people ended up uh so that was

2003
01:27:41,270 --> 01:27:35,990
interesting another interesting show we

2004
01:27:47,670 --> 01:27:44,100
and I thought we did she shows with him

2005
01:27:52,980 --> 01:27:47,680
and we did yes we did

2006
01:27:56,880 --> 01:27:52,990
June 27th 2006 and two weeks later we

2007
01:27:59,520 --> 01:27:56,890
had debate between him and our original

2008
01:28:02,400 --> 01:27:59,530
co-host David B Edney in which David had

2009
01:28:04,850 --> 01:28:02,410
done a photo analysis of some of the

2010
01:28:08,360 --> 01:28:04,860
building Myer photos and tore them apart

2011
01:28:11,340 --> 01:28:08,370
now whatever you say to Michael Horne a

2012
01:28:15,900 --> 01:28:11,350
politician would love him he is totally

2013
01:28:19,410 --> 01:28:15,910
loyal to his subject he's like the Sean

2014
01:28:23,010 --> 01:28:19,420
Spicer of the contactee movement who

2015
01:28:25,610 --> 01:28:23,020
would tell any lie to advance the

2016
01:28:30,720 --> 01:28:25,620
interests of his client if you call

2017
01:28:32,370 --> 01:28:30,730
billy meier client okay so that's the

2018
01:28:33,680 --> 01:28:32,380
that's the resemblance I can see I

2019
01:28:36,930 --> 01:28:33,690
thought that was an interesting episode

2020
01:28:41,010 --> 01:28:36,940
precipitated forum discussions that went

2021
01:28:45,060 --> 01:28:41,020
on and on in another way the appearance

2022
01:28:49,760 --> 01:28:45,070
of abduction investigator dr. David

2023
01:28:53,180 --> 01:28:49,770
Jacobs was interesting and telling

2024
01:29:00,360 --> 01:28:53,190
especially the most recent time because

2025
01:29:03,650 --> 01:29:00,370
he is a very polarizing figure to put

2026
01:29:07,170 --> 01:29:03,660
mildly a very very polarizing figure

2027
01:29:09,840 --> 01:29:07,180
some people like what he did and what

2028
01:29:12,120 --> 01:29:09,850
he's done other people think that he is

2029
01:29:16,560 --> 01:29:12,130
completely incompetent when it comes to

2030
01:29:19,350 --> 01:29:16,570
doing hypnosis he doesn't observe the

2031
01:29:24,470 --> 01:29:19,360
proper cautions and thus his evidence is

2032
01:29:27,350 --> 01:29:24,480
very tainted and when he got into this

2033
01:29:29,190 --> 01:29:27,360
interaction with a former subject who

2034
01:29:31,560 --> 01:29:29,200
started I don't know some people say

2035
01:29:34,320 --> 01:29:31,570
they she stalked him but certainly

2036
01:29:36,570 --> 01:29:34,330
followed him around and sent to anyone

2037
01:29:38,880 --> 01:29:36,580
who would listen lengthy critics

2038
01:29:40,530 --> 01:29:38,890
criticisms of his work we're not gonna

2039
01:29:43,590 --> 01:29:40,540
mention her name because her name was

2040
01:29:45,660 --> 01:29:43,600
fake anyway as a result of that whenever

2041
01:29:48,860 --> 01:29:45,670
we bring up the subject in our forums it

2042
01:29:51,300 --> 01:29:48,870
got wacky you may have seen this Lou

2043
01:29:52,979 --> 01:29:51,310
anytime we mentioned David Jacobs and

2044
01:29:55,440 --> 01:29:52,989
that other person

2045
01:29:58,590 --> 01:29:55,450
the forums just kind of got bent out of

2046
01:30:00,930 --> 01:29:58,600
shape so we haven't had him on because I

2047
01:30:03,810 --> 01:30:00,940
don't think he liked us after that show

2048
01:30:05,420 --> 01:30:03,820
David Jacobs I thought he felt that we

2049
01:30:07,770 --> 01:30:05,430
were pushing him too hard

2050
01:30:11,940 --> 01:30:07,780
yes are you going to express your

2051
01:30:14,390 --> 01:30:11,950
opinions of dr. Dickens or not let's

2052
01:30:16,500 --> 01:30:14,400
talk about his work not about his

2053
01:30:19,380 --> 01:30:16,510
unfortunate situation with his one

2054
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:19,390
subject well let's do a break first

2055
01:30:23,190 --> 01:30:21,010
again we'll continue with our

2056
01:30:25,350 --> 01:30:23,200
discussions and our responses to Lois

2057
01:30:31,270 --> 01:30:25,360
shins questions with Gene and Randall

2058
01:30:31,280 --> 01:30:39,560
[Music]

2059
01:30:48,070 --> 01:30:43,450
thank you for listening to GCN

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2142
01:34:16,410 --> 01:34:04,139
get one absolutely free go to my pillow

2143
01:34:16,420 --> 01:34:39,620
[Music]

2144
01:34:42,709 --> 01:34:41,330
when you most needed visit portable

2145
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2146
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2147
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2148
01:35:03,399 --> 01:35:00,360
family from the future and you are

2149
01:35:14,300 --> 01:35:03,409
listening to the podcast the gold

2150
01:35:16,160 --> 01:35:14,310
paranormal radio we continue Chris

2151
01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:16,170
O'Brien on special assignment kind of

2152
01:35:19,910 --> 01:35:18,330
gang a few personal things together

2153
01:35:21,590 --> 01:35:19,920
Randall Murphy is our guest co-host

2154
01:35:24,709 --> 01:35:21,600
again Luis Sheehan is one of our

2155
01:35:26,419 --> 01:35:24,719
listeners who's here to ask us questions

2156
01:35:29,840 --> 01:35:26,429
that we do not expect there is no

2157
01:35:32,149 --> 01:35:29,850
preparation for it he understands now

2158
01:35:34,189 --> 01:35:32,159
the way the show is done which is we may

2159
01:35:36,110 --> 01:35:34,199
know directions in which we're taking

2160
01:35:38,870 --> 01:35:36,120
but we don't know what a listeners gonna

2161
01:35:41,000 --> 01:35:38,880
ask what a guest is going to ask us we

2162
01:35:42,939 --> 01:35:41,010
just go on and on so you were starting

2163
01:35:47,209 --> 01:35:42,949
in something you were asking more about

2164
01:35:48,919 --> 01:35:47,219
reactions of David it was correct and

2165
01:35:50,689 --> 01:35:48,929
again we're just focusing on his

2166
01:35:53,390 --> 01:35:50,699
hypnosis and his theories that he's

2167
01:35:55,750 --> 01:35:53,400
developed for his his explanations that

2168
01:35:57,979 --> 01:35:55,760
he's developed and not relating to the

2169
01:36:01,370 --> 01:35:57,989
unfortunate situation with his one

2170
01:36:02,200 --> 01:36:01,380
female test subject well let's put it

2171
01:36:05,959 --> 01:36:02,210
this way

2172
01:36:08,270 --> 01:36:05,969
Kevin Randle co-authored a book looking

2173
01:36:10,399 --> 01:36:08,280
into the usefulness of hypnotic

2174
01:36:13,160 --> 01:36:10,409
regression to get accurate information

2175
01:36:15,430 --> 01:36:13,170
from somebody and he's not impressed we

2176
01:36:20,140 --> 01:36:15,440
had him on the show discussing it I

2177
01:36:22,910 --> 01:36:20,150
worry about any case that involves

2178
01:36:26,870 --> 01:36:22,920
primarily someone's memories recovered

2179
01:36:28,939 --> 01:36:26,880
through hypnosis I worry when someone

2180
01:36:30,890 --> 01:36:28,949
asks leading questions and then says is

2181
01:36:33,680 --> 01:36:30,900
David Jacob said it doesn't matter

2182
01:36:35,810 --> 01:36:33,690
there's no such thing of course there is

2183
01:36:38,840 --> 01:36:35,820
if you're taking a person under hypnosis

2184
01:36:40,850 --> 01:36:38,850
and you are somehow manipulating them to

2185
01:36:43,550 --> 01:36:40,860
give you a certain answer you may get

2186
01:36:46,520 --> 01:36:43,560
the answer you want you may get the

2187
01:36:50,689 --> 01:36:46,530
answer you suspect but it may not be

2188
01:36:51,570 --> 01:36:50,699
what really happened so I think he does

2189
01:36:53,550 --> 01:36:51,580
his

2190
01:36:55,200 --> 01:36:53,560
subject to the service because I think

2191
01:36:59,130 --> 01:36:55,210
there are lots of sincere people out

2192
01:37:00,690 --> 01:36:59,140
there who genuinely have an experience

2193
01:37:02,850 --> 01:37:00,700
they cannot explain that's the abduction

2194
01:37:05,820 --> 01:37:02,860
experience they have no idea what's gone

2195
01:37:08,100 --> 01:37:05,830
on with their lives some people are

2196
01:37:10,800 --> 01:37:08,110
really really traumatized as a result

2197
01:37:11,180 --> 01:37:10,810
and I'd like to know what happened to

2198
01:37:14,490 --> 01:37:11,190
them

2199
01:37:17,280 --> 01:37:14,500
now some people feel that this

2200
01:37:19,890 --> 01:37:17,290
phenomenon is separate from the normal

2201
01:37:22,680 --> 01:37:19,900
UFO sighting experience I think Jerome

2202
01:37:26,850 --> 01:37:22,690
Clark feels that way we know that people

2203
01:37:29,700 --> 01:37:26,860
like our friend red pill junky Miguel he

2204
01:37:31,740 --> 01:37:29,710
feels that near-death experiences and

2205
01:37:34,170 --> 01:37:31,750
UFO abductions have a startling

2206
01:37:36,360 --> 01:37:34,180
similarity anywhere an article for the

2207
01:37:38,490 --> 01:37:36,370
power cast newsletter saying why when

2208
01:37:40,950 --> 01:37:38,500
you look at that you can say well people

2209
01:37:44,280 --> 01:37:40,960
who are having abductions may be

2210
01:37:46,080 --> 01:37:44,290
interacting with something but maybe the

2211
01:37:48,720 --> 01:37:46,090
reason that it appears to be ufo-related

2212
01:37:52,020 --> 01:37:48,730
is strictly because that's the culture

2213
01:37:53,630 --> 01:37:52,030
in which they live that if they live

2214
01:37:55,710 --> 01:37:53,640
that a different time

2215
01:37:58,430 --> 01:37:55,720
they'd interact with something else

2216
01:38:02,730 --> 01:37:58,440
could be leprechauns or something else

2217
01:38:05,130 --> 01:38:02,740
right you see what I mean I do if you're

2218
01:38:07,290 --> 01:38:05,140
asking me that question Oh a brief

2219
01:38:10,140 --> 01:38:07,300
anecdote from my end I moved to

2220
01:38:12,930 --> 01:38:10,150
California a few years ago and I looked

2221
01:38:15,510 --> 01:38:12,940
up some UFO groups I'd never join one

2222
01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:15,520
and only one person responded and this

2223
01:38:20,520 --> 01:38:18,010
lady told me that she was she had alien

2224
01:38:23,670 --> 01:38:20,530
DNA but I could tell from her behavior

2225
01:38:26,280 --> 01:38:23,680
that there were a lot of issues she had

2226
01:38:28,560 --> 01:38:26,290
I'm not a psychiatrist a psychologist my

2227
01:38:30,060 --> 01:38:28,570
you know but it was clear she had some

2228
01:38:32,340 --> 01:38:30,070
significant issues and I know she was on

2229
01:38:35,060 --> 01:38:32,350
wall of medication and I came to the

2230
01:38:38,070 --> 01:38:35,070
same conclusion that if she had lived

2231
01:38:40,010 --> 01:38:38,080
300 years ago she would say she had

2232
01:38:42,060 --> 01:38:40,020
leprechaun DNA or something like that

2233
01:38:44,670 --> 01:38:42,070
which brings me to the next question

2234
01:38:46,290 --> 01:38:44,680
have you read Polly's book I don't even

2235
01:38:49,320 --> 01:38:46,300
know the title because I've not read it

2236
01:38:50,880 --> 01:38:49,330
but about Patagonia and what is what

2237
01:38:52,410 --> 01:38:50,890
could you summarize that book for your

2238
01:38:54,360 --> 01:38:52,420
listeners because I know so many people

2239
01:38:57,030 --> 01:38:54,370
speak with of it with restaurant

2240
01:38:57,650 --> 01:38:57,040
reverence but I have not had the time to

2241
01:39:01,560 --> 01:38:57,660
read it

2242
01:39:05,220 --> 01:39:01,570
passports on gum that's where he goes

2243
01:39:08,880 --> 01:39:05,230
into a lot of mythology that parallels

2244
01:39:09,990 --> 01:39:08,890
the UFO phenomena and beyond that you

2245
01:39:12,240 --> 01:39:10,000
just have to read the book and go

2246
01:39:14,940 --> 01:39:12,250
through the number of stories and

2247
01:39:19,410 --> 01:39:14,950
accounts that he deals with in the book

2248
01:39:22,110 --> 01:39:19,420
itself my comment on it typically is

2249
01:39:25,010 --> 01:39:22,120
that well it's natural for us to try to

2250
01:39:28,130 --> 01:39:25,020
explain what we don't understand given

2251
01:39:31,680 --> 01:39:28,140
the knowledge that we have at the time

2252
01:39:34,080 --> 01:39:31,690
so we have to be careful about assuming

2253
01:39:36,930 --> 01:39:34,090
that simply gets somebody perhaps in the

2254
01:39:39,630 --> 01:39:36,940
past if might interpret it one way that

2255
01:39:41,910 --> 01:39:39,640
modern interpretations are no more

2256
01:39:44,400 --> 01:39:41,920
accurate than theirs in other words

2257
01:39:46,380 --> 01:39:44,410
people used to think the Thunder was the

2258
01:39:48,120 --> 01:39:46,390
hammer of the gods and now we know that

2259
01:39:50,610 --> 01:39:48,130
that's different because we've looked at

2260
01:39:53,160 --> 01:39:50,620
it with a critical mind and we have

2261
01:39:56,130 --> 01:39:53,170
scientific thinking we're much better

2262
01:40:00,000 --> 01:39:56,140
educated and therefore I think there's a

2263
01:40:03,120 --> 01:40:00,010
hierarchy of theories that in modern day

2264
01:40:06,240 --> 01:40:03,130
tend to be tend to carry more weight

2265
01:40:09,450 --> 01:40:06,250
than say something from the 1800's or

2266
01:40:11,100 --> 01:40:09,460
classical antiquity so so we have to be

2267
01:40:13,470 --> 01:40:11,110
careful about saying oh well you know

2268
01:40:15,750 --> 01:40:13,480
UFOs could be anything it doesn't matter

2269
01:40:18,270 --> 01:40:15,760
it's all mythology I don't buy into it I

2270
01:40:21,720 --> 01:40:18,280
don't and in a recent interview with

2271
01:40:23,660 --> 01:40:21,730
valet you know we did cover that to some

2272
01:40:26,610 --> 01:40:23,670
degree and he admits well you know

2273
01:40:29,010 --> 01:40:26,620
mythological concepts don't have radar

2274
01:40:32,570 --> 01:40:29,020
returns so you know we're looking at

2275
01:40:35,910 --> 01:40:32,580
something that is materially real not

2276
01:40:39,210 --> 01:40:35,920
mythological but is this like Gestalt

2277
01:40:42,120 --> 01:40:39,220
now that I hear in montes Dara and dad

2278
01:40:43,710 --> 01:40:42,130
UFOs are not necessarily nuts and bolts

2279
01:40:45,300 --> 01:40:43,720
coming from other planets but they could

2280
01:40:47,640 --> 01:40:45,310
be interred in mention or some other

2281
01:40:50,190 --> 01:40:47,650
explanation something along the lines of

2282
01:40:53,160 --> 01:40:50,200
what Keane was saying is this like going

2283
01:40:55,470 --> 01:40:53,170
along or substantiating the logic that

2284
01:40:57,690 --> 01:40:55,480
gene was kind of expressing that UFO

2285
01:41:00,390 --> 01:40:57,700
shouldn't be understood to be such a

2286
01:41:02,520 --> 01:41:00,400
narrow interpretation I guess until

2287
01:41:04,020 --> 01:41:02,530
they're proven until we have something

2288
01:41:06,300 --> 01:41:04,030
right in front of us and we can drive

2289
01:41:08,700 --> 01:41:06,310
some around is that what is that what

2290
01:41:11,850 --> 01:41:08,710
you're getting at you I think we should

2291
01:41:13,650 --> 01:41:11,860
look as much on the form as a substance

2292
01:41:16,860 --> 01:41:13,660
because the form may not be what really

2293
01:41:18,930 --> 01:41:16,870
is we don't know that's really that we

2294
01:41:21,479 --> 01:41:18,940
see it that way because of our culture

2295
01:41:23,970 --> 01:41:21,489
but if this is a race of people or

2296
01:41:26,880 --> 01:41:23,980
beings who have come here from other

2297
01:41:28,439 --> 01:41:26,890
star systems say and there are hundreds

2298
01:41:30,900 --> 01:41:28,449
or thousands of years ahead of us

2299
01:41:33,209 --> 01:41:30,910
if there are thousand years ahead of us

2300
01:41:35,760 --> 01:41:33,219
for five thousand or ten thousand would

2301
01:41:38,600 --> 01:41:35,770
we even recognize their means of travel

2302
01:41:42,300 --> 01:41:38,610
that means a travel is viewed in the

2303
01:41:45,060 --> 01:41:42,310
image of star trek say you know we have

2304
01:41:47,939 --> 01:41:45,070
star trek we have physical spaceships

2305
01:41:50,250 --> 01:41:47,949
doing physical things but that's

2306
01:41:52,830 --> 01:41:50,260
depicting humanity in the 23rd century

2307
01:41:55,140 --> 01:41:52,840
and we assume to earn fifty three

2308
01:41:57,720 --> 01:41:55,150
hundred years from now that's what

2309
01:41:59,189 --> 01:41:57,730
things are gonna be because that's what

2310
01:42:01,200 --> 01:41:59,199
our sci-fi writers have dreamed up

2311
01:42:02,930 --> 01:42:01,210
what's gonna happen a thousand years

2312
01:42:05,490 --> 01:42:02,940
from now five thousand years from now

2313
01:42:09,900 --> 01:42:05,500
can we go from one place to the other

2314
01:42:11,760 --> 01:42:09,910
like the Q continuum beings do would we

2315
01:42:14,850 --> 01:42:11,770
even see them the way they really look

2316
01:42:17,610 --> 01:42:14,860
could we even perceive their technology

2317
01:42:21,000 --> 01:42:17,620
as technology because we perceive Star

2318
01:42:22,920 --> 01:42:21,010
Trek in relation to our technology or it

2319
01:42:26,930 --> 01:42:22,930
influences our technology in certain

2320
01:42:29,880 --> 01:42:26,940
ways like the star attack clamshell

2321
01:42:32,970 --> 01:42:29,890
mobile handset from the 90s from

2322
01:42:35,430 --> 01:42:32,980
Motorola possible tablets like an iPad

2323
01:42:38,790 --> 01:42:35,440
although 2001 a Space Odyssey depicted

2324
01:42:40,680 --> 01:42:38,800
tablets as well inventions that are

2325
01:42:41,959 --> 01:42:40,690
based on Star Trek technology I mean

2326
01:42:45,450 --> 01:42:41,969
scientists are looking into matter

2327
01:42:48,390 --> 01:42:45,460
transportation teleportation devices

2328
01:42:52,680 --> 01:42:48,400
they're looking into warp drive and this

2329
01:42:55,800 --> 01:42:52,690
is all based on our cultural image that

2330
01:42:57,900 --> 01:42:55,810
brings a Star Trek and even Star Wars if

2331
01:43:00,270 --> 01:42:57,910
you get past the mystical stuff and the

2332
01:43:03,930 --> 01:43:00,280
force it's still physical spaceships

2333
01:43:08,160 --> 01:43:03,940
doing physical things that's why we look

2334
01:43:11,160 --> 01:43:08,170
at it as here as alien instead of

2335
01:43:14,250 --> 01:43:11,170
necessarily extraterrestrial and craft

2336
01:43:17,520 --> 01:43:14,260
in terms of some sort of a transport

2337
01:43:21,300 --> 01:43:17,530
mechanism something that gets them from

2338
01:43:23,820 --> 01:43:21,310
there into our perceptual frame of

2339
01:43:26,100 --> 01:43:23,830
reference so you know we don't know that

2340
01:43:28,590 --> 01:43:26,110
it's riveted metal pieces of craft

2341
01:43:31,050 --> 01:43:28,600
necessarily we do have some pretty

2342
01:43:34,800 --> 01:43:31,060
strong circumstantial evidence to

2343
01:43:37,350 --> 01:43:34,810
just that some of the reports are of

2344
01:43:39,810 --> 01:43:37,360
those kinds of craft but we have to be

2345
01:43:42,690 --> 01:43:39,820
careful I agree in making assumptions

2346
01:43:45,740 --> 01:43:42,700
about the full range of them because

2347
01:43:48,600 --> 01:43:45,750
they may not be that type of thing but

2348
01:43:51,450 --> 01:43:48,610
simply calling them alien craft I think

2349
01:43:54,330 --> 01:43:51,460
is gives us a wide enough field of

2350
01:43:57,780 --> 01:43:54,340
possibility and find enough focus that

2351
01:43:59,820 --> 01:43:57,790
we can make the subject less nebulous

2352
01:44:03,000 --> 01:43:59,830
and give us something to look into

2353
01:44:04,650 --> 01:44:03,010
that doesn't include just every wild

2354
01:44:07,770 --> 01:44:04,660
theory that could be out there that

2355
01:44:10,800 --> 01:44:07,780
makes no sense yes but you still are

2356
01:44:13,410 --> 01:44:10,810
looking at it in terms of our Star Trek

2357
01:44:16,260 --> 01:44:13,420
framework so maybe it isn't quite what

2358
01:44:17,820 --> 01:44:16,270
we see maybe we see it that way because

2359
01:44:20,430 --> 01:44:17,830
of what they're doing or what we

2360
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:20,440
perceive it could be something else but

2361
01:44:27,480 --> 01:44:24,010
we still say okay et is very highly

2362
01:44:29,040 --> 01:44:27,490
advanced and they manifest themselves in

2363
01:44:33,390 --> 01:44:29,050
a way we understand like they did in

2364
01:44:35,970 --> 01:44:33,400
contact where et manifested itself is

2365
01:44:38,820 --> 01:44:35,980
self herself to the Jodie Foster

2366
01:44:40,200 --> 01:44:38,830
character as relate dad because we

2367
01:44:42,420 --> 01:44:40,210
couldn't accept this true appearance so

2368
01:44:44,490 --> 01:44:42,430
maybe that was a dream experience it all

2369
01:44:47,430 --> 01:44:44,500
happened in her head because remember

2370
01:44:50,340 --> 01:44:47,440
although she imagined or thought she

2371
01:44:51,720 --> 01:44:50,350
traveled to another planet revolving

2372
01:44:55,140 --> 01:44:51,730
around another star system and that

2373
01:44:57,870 --> 01:44:55,150
device she really didn't go anywhere

2374
01:45:00,660 --> 01:44:57,880
physically so where did you go how did

2375
01:45:02,760 --> 01:45:00,670
she go and is that another image of how

2376
01:45:06,270 --> 01:45:02,770
et gets here if there's an et is that

2377
01:45:08,060 --> 01:45:06,280
what they do or is it even an et again

2378
01:45:10,170 --> 01:45:08,070
we might be dealing with some kind of

2379
01:45:12,600 --> 01:45:10,180
consciousness that we can't even

2380
01:45:14,640 --> 01:45:12,610
understand a hundred years from now we

2381
01:45:17,190 --> 01:45:14,650
may have UFOs and have a totally

2382
01:45:18,960 --> 01:45:17,200
different idea we have Jay Randall

2383
01:45:27,850 --> 01:45:18,970
Murphy Jean Steinberg Lewis Sheehan

2384
01:45:27,860 --> 01:45:32,979
thank you for listening to GCN

2385
01:45:40,300 --> 01:45:38,350
visit GP and live.com today we also have

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2407
01:46:36,340 --> 01:46:33,560
the para cast to go to steward da to the

2408
01:46:41,620 --> 01:46:36,350
para cast comm stop by and take a

2409
01:46:44,110 --> 01:46:41,630
shopping tour anytime anyplace anywhere

2410
01:46:46,630 --> 01:46:44,120
radio remains the most intimate of all

2411
01:46:49,420 --> 01:46:46,640
forms of media at home at work in the

2412
01:46:51,490 --> 01:46:49,430
car on smartphones over 90 percent of

2413
01:46:53,440 --> 01:46:51,500
consumers still listen to radio every

2414
01:46:55,630 --> 01:46:53,450
week that makes choosing radio as a

2415
01:46:57,880 --> 01:46:55,640
place to advertise your business one of

2416
01:47:01,330 --> 01:46:57,890
the best decisions you can make email

2417
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advertise at GCN live.com and partner up

2418
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with an experienced GCN representative

2419
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advertise at GC and live.com easy

2420
01:47:12,520 --> 01:47:10,340
affordable effective in an emergency you

2421
01:47:14,440 --> 01:47:12,530
need a fire now but what if the wood is

2422
01:47:16,510 --> 01:47:14,450
wet no problem for insta

2423
01:47:18,700 --> 01:47:16,520
hour non toxic fire starter packs light

2424
01:47:20,410 --> 01:47:18,710
wet wood can even burn on water or in

2425
01:47:21,970 --> 01:47:20,420
any weather sustains winds up to 30

2426
01:47:24,550 --> 01:47:21,980
miles per hour and each pouch weighs

2427
01:47:26,680 --> 01:47:24,560
only 1.75 ounces need an emergency stove

2428
01:47:28,660 --> 01:47:26,690
get the insta fire inferno stove that

2429
01:47:29,770 --> 01:47:28,670
boils water in under three minutes temps

2430
01:47:31,239 --> 01:47:29,780
up to 1,500 degrees

2431
01:47:32,890 --> 01:47:31,249
free shipping on anything

2432
01:47:34,899 --> 01:47:32,900
Gotha in stuff I wrote on flash radio

2433
01:47:37,509 --> 01:47:34,909
specials and jet doors today is the fire

2434
01:47:46,209 --> 01:47:37,519
fire in an instant hence the fire calm /

2435
01:47:54,250 --> 01:47:49,910
welcome back into the para cast the gold

2436
01:48:03,229 --> 01:47:54,260
standard of paranormal radio and now

2437
01:48:05,359 --> 01:48:03,239
here's Jane Steinberg we have J Randall

2438
01:48:07,700 --> 01:48:05,369
Murphy as guest co-host and Lois she and

2439
01:48:09,080 --> 01:48:07,710
one of our listeners who volunteer to

2440
01:48:11,629 --> 01:48:09,090
join us a number of others wanted to

2441
01:48:14,479 --> 01:48:11,639
come on but work schedules intervened

2442
01:48:18,200 --> 01:48:14,489
I've just heard from a few so maybe next

2443
01:48:19,689 --> 01:48:18,210
time maybe the idea that Lou had about

2444
01:48:22,640 --> 01:48:19,699
having someone like Stanton Friedman

2445
01:48:26,540 --> 01:48:22,650
submit to listen to questions who are

2446
01:48:30,140 --> 01:48:26,550
present as panelists make it

2447
01:48:32,270 --> 01:48:30,150
unpredictable and I think UFOs in many

2448
01:48:34,220 --> 01:48:32,280
respects may be unpredictable because

2449
01:48:37,340 --> 01:48:34,230
again Randall you're still looking at it

2450
01:48:39,620 --> 01:48:37,350
in terms of our technology there is a

2451
01:48:41,330 --> 01:48:39,630
question I want a slew though and this

2452
01:48:44,689 --> 01:48:41,340
takes us back to the beginning of the

2453
01:48:46,250 --> 01:48:44,699
show where you were talking about you

2454
01:48:48,229 --> 01:48:46,260
got into it because of your interest in

2455
01:48:50,870 --> 01:48:48,239
ancient aliens and I'm kind of wondering

2456
01:48:53,090 --> 01:48:50,880
what your view on that is today and if

2457
01:48:54,800 --> 01:48:53,100
sort of how that's evolved especially in

2458
01:48:57,379 --> 01:48:54,810
light of I'm not sure if you've seen the

2459
01:48:59,120 --> 01:48:57,389
the expose it's called ancient aliens

2460
01:49:02,090 --> 01:48:59,130
debunked where it goes through quite a

2461
01:49:04,129 --> 01:49:02,100
number of cases to where they make the

2462
01:49:06,800 --> 01:49:04,139
claim that there were ancient aliens and

2463
01:49:08,359 --> 01:49:06,810
just pretty much it does actually debunk

2464
01:49:10,280 --> 01:49:08,369
them so you know kind of where do you

2465
01:49:12,379 --> 01:49:10,290
sit on that today I know there's this

2466
01:49:14,300 --> 01:49:12,389
show and you'd have to tell me the title

2467
01:49:15,649 --> 01:49:14,310
of it because I watched one episode and

2468
01:49:17,419 --> 01:49:15,659
I thought it was so terrible I haven't

2469
01:49:19,609 --> 01:49:17,429
watched it since I think it's been on

2470
01:49:22,669 --> 01:49:19,619
for god knows nine years

2471
01:49:25,070 --> 01:49:22,679
George sucralose I just thought it was

2472
01:49:26,870 --> 01:49:25,080
so poor or so unconvincing I couldn't

2473
01:49:29,600 --> 01:49:26,880
bring myself to watch it or use my time

2474
01:49:31,250 --> 01:49:29,610
like that so I don't know if that's a

2475
01:49:33,080 --> 01:49:31,260
beginning of an introduction as to where

2476
01:49:34,910 --> 01:49:33,090
I think about the ancient aliens in my

2477
01:49:37,180 --> 01:49:34,920
mind I don't doubt that there were

2478
01:49:40,370 --> 01:49:37,190
visitations but most of the evidence

2479
01:49:43,700 --> 01:49:40,380
offered up to suggest that there were

2480
01:49:46,399 --> 01:49:43,710
visits I think is just to hokum so I I

2481
01:49:49,700 --> 01:49:46,409
don't spend much time reviewing that

2482
01:49:51,830 --> 01:49:49,710
information but when I was young when

2483
01:49:54,500 --> 01:49:51,840
church for the gods came out whatever I

2484
01:49:57,770 --> 01:49:54,510
was 6 years 9 years old something like

2485
01:49:59,270 --> 01:49:57,780
that and at that point it was just very

2486
01:50:01,610 --> 01:49:59,280
stimulating and the core

2487
01:50:04,340 --> 01:50:01,620
we brought out passages from the Old

2488
01:50:06,530 --> 01:50:04,350
Testament in particular that sounds as

2489
01:50:08,600 --> 01:50:06,540
if they were involved UFO it was an

2490
01:50:11,870 --> 01:50:08,610
interesting way of relooking at things

2491
01:50:13,910 --> 01:50:11,880
which I appreciated but has much without

2492
01:50:16,070 --> 01:50:13,920
evidence what held up I think the

2493
01:50:18,290 --> 01:50:16,080
answer's no I hope that answer your

2494
01:50:20,510 --> 01:50:18,300
question I do have another question for

2495
01:50:22,100 --> 01:50:20,520
Jean I'm gonna put his feet to the fire

2496
01:50:24,650 --> 01:50:22,110
he's been critical of MU fons

2497
01:50:26,600 --> 01:50:24,660
questionnaire about not getting into the

2498
01:50:29,480 --> 01:50:26,610
psychological aspects or the background

2499
01:50:32,240 --> 01:50:29,490
aspects of the witnesses but the

2500
01:50:34,460 --> 01:50:32,250
specific suggestions what does he get

2501
01:50:36,350 --> 01:50:34,470
was he being Jean I'm speaking of him in

2502
01:50:38,390 --> 01:50:36,360
the third person as I speak Jean do you

2503
01:50:40,490 --> 01:50:38,400
have specific questions where are you

2504
01:50:44,270 --> 01:50:40,500
going with these suggestions I'm

2505
01:50:47,240 --> 01:50:44,280
intrigued by why you are so strongly

2506
01:50:49,520 --> 01:50:47,250
committed to revising the approach to

2507
01:50:51,410 --> 01:50:49,530
analyzing UFOs in this manner you could

2508
01:50:53,540 --> 01:50:51,420
answer that please okay well the

2509
01:50:55,880 --> 01:50:53,550
definition of insanity is doing the same

2510
01:50:57,920 --> 01:50:55,890
thing over and over again and expecting

2511
01:51:04,040 --> 01:50:57,930
a different answer and MUFON has been at

2512
01:51:06,380 --> 01:51:04,050
it now for what 48 years 1969 started

2513
01:51:08,750 --> 01:51:06,390
out as the mutual UFO network a splinter

2514
01:51:11,450 --> 01:51:08,760
group that moved off from April and

2515
01:51:12,980 --> 01:51:11,460
still going on and they really haven't

2516
01:51:15,920 --> 01:51:12,990
changed much and they haven't given us

2517
01:51:17,870 --> 01:51:15,930
that much in the way of positive results

2518
01:51:19,910 --> 01:51:17,880
the only thing has changed as they seem

2519
01:51:22,670 --> 01:51:19,920
to have decided to become more

2520
01:51:25,130 --> 01:51:22,680
commercial and kind of set aside their

2521
01:51:27,260 --> 01:51:25,140
goal of doing scientific research to

2522
01:51:30,140 --> 01:51:27,270
entertaining people with a hangar one TV

2523
01:51:33,280 --> 01:51:30,150
show which had times of passing

2524
01:51:34,940 --> 01:51:33,290
resemblance the truth to the last MUFON

2525
01:51:37,250 --> 01:51:34,950
Convention where they're talking about

2526
01:51:39,620 --> 01:51:37,260
secret space program and bringing on

2527
01:51:41,450 --> 01:51:39,630
crazy time travelers we've talked about

2528
01:51:44,110 --> 01:51:41,460
that in previous episode the power cast

2529
01:51:46,550 --> 01:51:44,120
I think if they want to investigate UFOs

2530
01:51:48,530 --> 01:51:46,560
the argument I make is that they're

2531
01:51:52,010 --> 01:51:48,540
looking at only part of the mystery the

2532
01:51:54,950 --> 01:51:52,020
part of the mystery is the event but we

2533
01:51:59,410 --> 01:51:54,960
don't know if we can divorce that event

2534
01:52:02,810 --> 01:51:59,420
from the witness who sees that thing and

2535
01:52:05,120 --> 01:52:02,820
what I think they need to do at the very

2536
01:52:07,370 --> 01:52:05,130
least is not well if they volunteer the

2537
01:52:10,070 --> 01:52:07,380
information that's fine that's what Jan

2538
01:52:11,850 --> 01:52:10,080
Harz and the executive director says

2539
01:52:13,740 --> 01:52:11,860
what I said

2540
01:52:16,709 --> 01:52:13,750
is that why not simply have miss

2541
01:52:20,430 --> 01:52:16,719
questions asked about the background of

2542
01:52:22,620 --> 01:52:20,440
the witness have they seen other unusual

2543
01:52:27,030 --> 01:52:22,630
phenomena what about tell us about it

2544
01:52:29,270 --> 01:52:27,040
the family history tell us previous UFO

2545
01:52:33,090 --> 01:52:29,280
sightings tell us ghosts whatever

2546
01:52:36,000 --> 01:52:33,100
Bigfoot tell us learn something do a

2547
01:52:39,990 --> 01:52:36,010
profile of the witness and see if that

2548
01:52:43,470 --> 01:52:40,000
leads us to any ideas about who might be

2549
01:52:46,229 --> 01:52:43,480
seeing UFOs can we find that certain

2550
01:52:47,700 --> 01:52:46,239
people have a propensity to see things

2551
01:52:50,220 --> 01:52:47,710
more than other people it's something

2552
01:52:52,500 --> 01:52:50,230
that we see some people see UFOs all the

2553
01:52:55,229 --> 01:52:52,510
time might be the luck of the draw

2554
01:52:56,879 --> 01:52:55,239
some people never see them some people

2555
01:52:59,280 --> 01:52:56,889
may have something weird happen to them

2556
01:53:01,950 --> 01:52:59,290
but nothing defined enough like me so I

2557
01:53:03,959 --> 01:53:01,960
think that's where a MUFON is selling

2558
01:53:06,300 --> 01:53:03,969
itself short instead of becoming a

2559
01:53:09,470 --> 01:53:06,310
commercial organization for the purpose

2560
01:53:13,560 --> 01:53:09,480
of filling seats and auditoriums and

2561
01:53:15,600 --> 01:53:13,570
increasing the cash flow they need to do

2562
01:53:17,010 --> 01:53:15,610
a more thorough effort of investigation

2563
01:53:20,000 --> 01:53:17,020
but that requires a different attitude

2564
01:53:23,399 --> 01:53:20,010
as long as they think the UFOs are

2565
01:53:25,890 --> 01:53:23,409
separate from the witness like looking

2566
01:53:28,229 --> 01:53:25,900
at an aircraft you're not a participant

2567
01:53:30,000 --> 01:53:28,239
in the event if you don't allow for the

2568
01:53:31,470 --> 01:53:30,010
possibility that they're participants I

2569
01:53:33,330 --> 01:53:31,480
think they're not doing the subject

2570
01:53:37,020 --> 01:53:33,340
justice oh by the way listeners

2571
01:53:39,899 --> 01:53:37,030
I have asked once again Jan horizon-- to

2572
01:53:40,770 --> 01:53:39,909
come on the show with so far no answer

2573
01:53:43,560 --> 01:53:40,780
go ahead

2574
01:53:45,090 --> 01:53:43,570
you know Jeanne fabulous fabulous I

2575
01:53:47,970 --> 01:53:45,100
can't say enough good stuff about that

2576
01:53:51,120 --> 01:53:47,980
attitude that is so that focuses right

2577
01:53:53,490 --> 01:53:51,130
in on the people who are involved in

2578
01:53:55,950 --> 01:53:53,500
making the reports and they are in and

2579
01:53:59,010 --> 01:53:55,960
observe of themselves the evidence you

2580
01:54:01,859 --> 01:53:59,020
cannot like you say divorce the observer

2581
01:54:03,959 --> 01:54:01,869
from what's being observed I really do

2582
01:54:06,359 --> 01:54:03,969
think that you're onto something there

2583
01:54:08,669 --> 01:54:06,369
what I'm envisioning in the good old

2584
01:54:11,550 --> 01:54:08,679
days was you're on the lookout for

2585
01:54:13,530 --> 01:54:11,560
Japanese aircraft attacking your ship so

2586
01:54:15,720 --> 01:54:13,540
you keep a keen eye out and if you see

2587
01:54:17,189 --> 01:54:15,730
one you report it and that's the end of

2588
01:54:19,530 --> 01:54:17,199
the story they you know the other people

2589
01:54:21,300 --> 01:54:19,540
take it from there it doesn't matter how

2590
01:54:23,189 --> 01:54:21,310
many I've seen in the past what are you

2591
01:54:25,230 --> 01:54:23,199
implying by the fact that someone may

2592
01:54:27,000 --> 01:54:25,240
have seen 20 and

2593
01:54:28,560 --> 01:54:27,010
person may have seen one what are you

2594
01:54:30,930 --> 01:54:28,570
getting at there I mean I have my own

2595
01:54:33,510 --> 01:54:30,940
suspicions but do you share my

2596
01:54:36,120 --> 01:54:33,520
suspicions that people who are multiple

2597
01:54:38,670 --> 01:54:36,130
experiences by less credible than the

2598
01:54:40,080 --> 01:54:38,680
singular I don't think it's an ability I

2599
01:54:42,150 --> 01:54:40,090
think it's something in their past

2600
01:54:43,680 --> 01:54:42,160
something in their genetic makeup or

2601
01:54:45,750 --> 01:54:43,690
just the luck of the draw

2602
01:54:47,700 --> 01:54:45,760
that might make them more prone to see

2603
01:54:50,190 --> 01:54:47,710
something I don't think they just made

2604
01:54:50,520 --> 01:54:50,200
it up I think some people just made it

2605
01:54:52,830 --> 01:54:50,530
up

2606
01:54:54,900 --> 01:54:52,840
or had a real experience and this might

2607
01:54:57,540 --> 01:54:54,910
imply what happens to some so-called

2608
01:54:59,850 --> 01:54:57,550
experiencers or contactees where they

2609
01:55:01,410 --> 01:54:59,860
have the experience and they get some

2610
01:55:03,930 --> 01:55:01,420
kind of recognition

2611
01:55:06,810 --> 01:55:03,940
notability about it and after a while

2612
01:55:08,280 --> 01:55:06,820
people want to know well what's the next

2613
01:55:11,100 --> 01:55:08,290
story and they have to come up with a

2614
01:55:14,430 --> 01:55:11,110
second story and a third story and they

2615
01:55:16,740 --> 01:55:14,440
go on but that doesn't mean that this

2616
01:55:18,660 --> 01:55:16,750
implies that if you see a UFO more than

2617
01:55:20,460 --> 01:55:18,670
once or twice you're making it up

2618
01:55:22,050 --> 01:55:20,470
because there are people there who are

2619
01:55:24,660 --> 01:55:22,060
looking for fame or fortune

2620
01:55:26,340 --> 01:55:24,670
it just happens to them and they report

2621
01:55:28,470 --> 01:55:26,350
it and I think they're reporting it

2622
01:55:31,470 --> 01:55:28,480
accurately and we need to find out

2623
01:55:33,320 --> 01:55:31,480
what's happening and also why they are

2624
01:55:35,370 --> 01:55:33,330
prone to seeing it again

2625
01:55:38,940 --> 01:55:35,380
understanding their family background

2626
01:55:41,370 --> 01:55:38,950
prior experiences where they live whole

2627
01:55:43,860 --> 01:55:41,380
bunch of things yeah fabulous we solu

2628
01:55:45,840 --> 01:55:43,870
why would you think that it it would

2629
01:55:49,350 --> 01:55:45,850
make a person less credible necessarily

2630
01:55:51,840 --> 01:55:49,360
well I've not seen one let alone ten so

2631
01:55:54,330 --> 01:55:51,850
I just think the odds are don't favor

2632
01:55:56,460 --> 01:55:54,340
somebody seeing ten I had an experience

2633
01:55:58,740 --> 01:55:56,470
I went again I moved to California a few

2634
01:56:00,930 --> 01:55:58,750
years ago so I live near where they hold

2635
01:56:04,740 --> 01:56:00,940
contact in the desert and a nice lady

2636
01:56:07,050 --> 01:56:04,750
and I met up there amongst other people

2637
01:56:09,720 --> 01:56:07,060
a crowd of people and this nice lady it

2638
01:56:11,490 --> 01:56:09,730
told me she had seen multiple UFOs while

2639
01:56:14,160 --> 01:56:11,500
we were there she pointed out something

2640
01:56:16,680 --> 01:56:14,170
in the sky which she said was a UFO it's

2641
01:56:18,360 --> 01:56:16,690
me look like a star you know I'm polite

2642
01:56:20,550 --> 01:56:18,370
I didn't say anything

2643
01:56:23,730 --> 01:56:20,560
that's clearly a star and it makes me

2644
01:56:26,070 --> 01:56:23,740
wonder about a lot of reported UFO I

2645
01:56:27,720 --> 01:56:26,080
don't know the way I was raised you

2646
01:56:30,690 --> 01:56:27,730
wouldn't lie about something like that

2647
01:56:32,190 --> 01:56:30,700
but as I lived life longer and longer I

2648
01:56:34,710 --> 01:56:32,200
realized her a lot of people out there

2649
01:56:36,330 --> 01:56:34,720
who will say anything I don't know I'm

2650
01:56:38,180 --> 01:56:36,340
not going anywhere with this particular

2651
01:56:39,770 --> 01:56:38,190
observation but I can

2652
01:56:41,300 --> 01:56:39,780
staying on the premise that we're

2653
01:56:44,450 --> 01:56:41,310
looking for honest people to report

2654
01:56:46,729 --> 01:56:44,460
honest observations and to make note of

2655
01:56:49,340 --> 01:56:46,739
them I do agree that I'm not aware that

2656
01:56:52,939 --> 01:56:49,350
I personally am not aware that MUFON has

2657
01:56:55,880 --> 01:56:52,949
done much to raise the bona fide ease of

2658
01:56:59,360 --> 01:56:55,890
the subject matter they have not to my

2659
01:57:02,150 --> 01:56:59,370
knowledge produced any craft any videos

2660
01:57:05,090 --> 01:57:02,160
that have persuaded world governments to

2661
01:57:06,709 --> 01:57:05,100
change their positions so I'm a little

2662
01:57:08,420 --> 01:57:06,719
disappointed in what new phone is

2663
01:57:10,550 --> 01:57:08,430
produced I don't understand the

2664
01:57:13,010 --> 01:57:10,560
structure of it where apparently a lot

2665
01:57:14,959 --> 01:57:13,020
of the reports cannot go uphill nothing

2666
01:57:16,220 --> 01:57:14,969
comes back downhill I just don't know if

2667
01:57:18,830 --> 01:57:16,230
it's because the fund doesn't have the

2668
01:57:21,290 --> 01:57:18,840
resources or what's going on well you

2669
01:57:23,240 --> 01:57:21,300
make a good point there like let's this

2670
01:57:24,830 --> 01:57:23,250
takes us back to like well Jean when you

2671
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were saying that having a clear

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understanding what the word means

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Randall Jean Louis you're in the para

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don't forget to visit our famous para

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2772
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para cast comm so Randall had a response

2773
02:02:06,010 --> 02:02:04,280
to that comment and made by Louis

2774
02:02:08,320 --> 02:02:06,020
Sheehan on this week's episode of the

2775
02:02:10,630 --> 02:02:08,330
Power casts go ahead please I can kind

2776
02:02:12,010 --> 02:02:10,640
of tie your comment in from earlier

2777
02:02:14,170 --> 02:02:12,020
where you were saying it doesn't help us

2778
02:02:16,960 --> 02:02:14,180
to have a clear understanding of what we

2779
02:02:19,810 --> 02:02:16,970
mean by UFO and then Lou's comment that

2780
02:02:21,940 --> 02:02:19,820
this witness that he was speaking to

2781
02:02:24,550 --> 02:02:21,950
from what he could tell what she was

2782
02:02:29,110 --> 02:02:24,560
looking at was a star and so when you go

2783
02:02:31,660 --> 02:02:29,120
into back into the AFR 202 the air force

2784
02:02:34,030 --> 02:02:31,670
definition the first thing it says that

2785
02:02:36,310 --> 02:02:34,040
you don't count as a UFO are familiar

2786
02:02:38,230 --> 02:02:36,320
and known objects and that includes

2787
02:02:40,810 --> 02:02:38,240
aircraft birds balloons kites

2788
02:02:43,510 --> 02:02:40,820
searchlights and astronomical bodies

2789
02:02:45,640 --> 02:02:43,520
including meteors planets and stars so

2790
02:02:47,860 --> 02:02:45,650
if it looks like a star you don't report

2791
02:02:50,290 --> 02:02:47,870
it as a UFO but people out there with

2792
02:02:52,480 --> 02:02:50,300
this idea in their head that well I

2793
02:02:55,690 --> 02:02:52,490
don't know what it is it looks like a

2794
02:03:00,220 --> 02:02:55,700
star but I can't be sure that's not a

2795
02:03:03,160 --> 02:03:00,230
UFO but you get a whole bunch of noise

2796
02:03:04,390 --> 02:03:03,170
into the reporting system because people

2797
02:03:06,160 --> 02:03:04,400
don't have a clear idea of what they're

2798
02:03:07,840 --> 02:03:06,170
talking about in the first place so I

2799
02:03:09,730 --> 02:03:07,850
think it really would help us to get

2800
02:03:12,610 --> 02:03:09,740
that straightened out in no uncertain

2801
02:03:14,080 --> 02:03:12,620
terms I'm gonna leave it be for the time

2802
02:03:17,050 --> 02:03:14,090
being I think we've been there and done

2803
02:03:19,300 --> 02:03:17,060
that I want to look at what we can do in

2804
02:03:22,570 --> 02:03:19,310
the future I want to pretend right now

2805
02:03:23,950 --> 02:03:22,580
that MUFON until they respond to some

2806
02:03:26,620 --> 02:03:23,960
very serious questions we've been asking

2807
02:03:28,510 --> 02:03:26,630
for months it's not relevant to current

2808
02:03:31,570 --> 02:03:28,520
UFO research because I haven't advanced

2809
02:03:36,310 --> 02:03:31,580
anything they haven't done anything past

2810
02:03:37,750 --> 02:03:36,320
the 1960s that sold us anything I don't

2811
02:03:40,450 --> 02:03:37,760
know if they've done anything beyond

2812
02:03:42,430 --> 02:03:40,460
what a pro did they were spin off from a

2813
02:03:45,580 --> 02:03:42,440
crow what have they done to Advanced

2814
02:03:48,070 --> 02:03:45,590
Research passed a pro or better I won't

2815
02:03:50,230 --> 02:03:48,080
count what nycap did in the 50s and 60s

2816
02:03:52,800 --> 02:03:50,240
because matric EO ran my campus a

2817
02:03:54,760 --> 02:03:52,810
lobbying organization strictly to get

2818
02:03:57,730 --> 02:03:54,770
congressional hearings on the subject

2819
02:03:59,860 --> 02:03:57,740
when that happened when we had the

2820
02:04:01,780 --> 02:03:59,870
Condon report which buried Project Blue

2821
02:04:02,530 --> 02:04:01,790
Book gave the Air Force the excuse to

2822
02:04:05,980 --> 02:04:02,540
close it down

2823
02:04:09,070 --> 02:04:05,990
once that happened NICAP had no reason

2824
02:04:10,600 --> 02:04:09,080
to exist because it was not an

2825
02:04:13,300 --> 02:04:10,610
investigative organization it was a

2826
02:04:15,880 --> 02:04:13,310
lobbying organization and I think that's

2827
02:04:17,560 --> 02:04:15,890
where we stand I mean what UFO

2828
02:04:20,920 --> 02:04:17,570
organizations are out there and we

2829
02:04:22,620 --> 02:04:20,930
obviously Randall has his but those that

2830
02:04:26,920 --> 02:04:22,630
are financed enough to actually have

2831
02:04:30,550 --> 02:04:26,930
field investigators were they doing when

2832
02:04:33,250 --> 02:04:30,560
someone sees a UFO where do we go well

2833
02:04:34,900 --> 02:04:33,260
like you're saying gene getting into the

2834
02:04:37,690 --> 02:04:34,910
actual witnesses themselves I think

2835
02:04:39,160 --> 02:04:37,700
that's that's really important and and

2836
02:04:43,360 --> 02:04:39,170
to throw in sort of the third

2837
02:04:45,880 --> 02:04:43,370
perspective yeah I admit that I am a

2838
02:04:47,260 --> 02:04:45,890
believer in alien visitation wherever

2839
02:04:50,140 --> 02:04:47,270
they're from and how they're getting

2840
02:04:52,630 --> 02:04:50,150
here exactly I'm not sure but it seems

2841
02:04:54,550 --> 02:04:52,640
to be happening to too many people to

2842
02:04:56,110 --> 02:04:54,560
simply say it's not happening and

2843
02:04:58,600 --> 02:04:56,120
therefore you kind of have to ask

2844
02:05:00,760 --> 02:04:58,610
yourself why and that's where the

2845
02:05:05,080 --> 02:05:00,770
connection for me between the witness

2846
02:05:07,540 --> 02:05:05,090
and the stimulus is in terms of you know

2847
02:05:11,230 --> 02:05:07,550
what it is causing it it implies that

2848
02:05:14,110 --> 02:05:11,240
whatever they are they're studying us

2849
02:05:17,200 --> 02:05:14,120
for some reason or another and if that's

2850
02:05:20,020 --> 02:05:17,210
the case then what you suggest by

2851
02:05:23,230 --> 02:05:20,030
studying the people means that if we're

2852
02:05:26,200 --> 02:05:23,240
the subject then we can extrapolate from

2853
02:05:28,780 --> 02:05:26,210
that some sort of intention about what

2854
02:05:31,120 --> 02:05:28,790
they're doing here and why beyond that

2855
02:05:33,880 --> 02:05:31,130
it's difficult to say I mean the the

2856
02:05:36,250 --> 02:05:33,890
pattern suggests some sort of study at a

2857
02:05:40,320 --> 02:05:36,260
distance where they don't get themselves

2858
02:05:42,820 --> 02:05:40,330
too involved in the actual experiment to

2859
02:05:44,830 --> 02:05:42,830
contaminate it that much unless it's

2860
02:05:48,010 --> 02:05:44,840
very specific it's sort of always on

2861
02:05:51,250 --> 02:05:48,020
their terms and it could explain a whole

2862
02:05:54,070 --> 02:05:51,260
variety of behaviors and experiences

2863
02:05:57,940 --> 02:05:54,080
including maybe as you suggested gene a

2864
02:06:00,490 --> 02:05:57,950
number of experiences by a single person

2865
02:06:01,800 --> 02:06:00,500
or family members and some people have

2866
02:06:04,710 --> 02:06:01,810
suggested it can go

2867
02:06:06,810 --> 02:06:04,720
a number of generations so this kind of

2868
02:06:08,960 --> 02:06:06,820
all fits with the idea that there's

2869
02:06:12,450 --> 02:06:08,970
there's some sort of a study going on

2870
02:06:16,110 --> 02:06:12,460
about us by them for some sort of a

2871
02:06:17,970 --> 02:06:16,120
reason what that reason is I'm not

2872
02:06:22,200 --> 02:06:17,980
entirely sure I mean that gets into a

2873
02:06:25,650 --> 02:06:22,210
lot of speculation but your idea to look

2874
02:06:28,200 --> 02:06:25,660
at the people behind them the reports I

2875
02:06:32,310 --> 02:06:28,210
think that speaks directly to the

2876
02:06:34,860 --> 02:06:32,320
possibility and the motivation for why

2877
02:06:36,300 --> 02:06:34,870
they're here that's why what I called

2878
02:06:38,610 --> 02:06:36,310
Chris for example one of the most

2879
02:06:40,200 --> 02:06:38,620
important people in ethology today when

2880
02:06:44,220 --> 02:06:40,210
you look at the sum total of his number

2881
02:06:46,620 --> 02:06:44,230
of experiences and you try to think of

2882
02:06:47,640 --> 02:06:46,630
some reason for why all of those things

2883
02:06:49,890 --> 02:06:47,650
would happen to him

2884
02:06:52,470 --> 02:06:49,900
it creates a picture that is really

2885
02:06:55,260 --> 02:06:52,480
quite extraordinary oh I want to ask you

2886
02:06:57,060 --> 02:06:55,270
Jean I know it's not the type of thought

2887
02:06:59,790 --> 02:06:57,070
process you enjoy going through but

2888
02:07:03,060 --> 02:06:59,800
what's your speculation as to why we're

2889
02:07:05,280 --> 02:07:03,070
being visited do you have any well the

2890
02:07:08,280 --> 02:07:05,290
question here assumes that we're being

2891
02:07:10,050 --> 02:07:08,290
deliberately visited as opposed to being

2892
02:07:13,170 --> 02:07:10,060
in touch with something that is always

2893
02:07:13,650 --> 02:07:13,180
there well let's just assume we're being

2894
02:07:15,750 --> 02:07:13,660
visited

2895
02:07:18,560 --> 02:07:15,760
okay well that's based on an assumption

2896
02:07:21,180 --> 02:07:18,570
that someone or something out there

2897
02:07:25,830 --> 02:07:21,190
finds us interesting enough to visit us

2898
02:07:29,430 --> 02:07:25,840
and as a result they or ear whatever

2899
02:07:34,140 --> 02:07:29,440
they are has to satisfy some curiosity

2900
02:07:37,470 --> 02:07:34,150
or it's part of a monitoring process of

2901
02:07:40,070 --> 02:07:37,480
our civilization or it's something that

2902
02:07:44,070 --> 02:07:40,080
we undergo as part of our development in

2903
02:07:46,320 --> 02:07:44,080
interacting with our universe we undergo

2904
02:07:48,870 --> 02:07:46,330
these experiences as we advance

2905
02:07:51,450 --> 02:07:48,880
ourselves oh that's interesting can you

2906
02:07:55,830 --> 02:07:51,460
elaborate on that a little more I think

2907
02:07:57,630 --> 02:07:55,840
what if as we grow as a species there

2908
02:08:00,240 --> 02:07:57,640
are certain things that happen to us

2909
02:08:02,400 --> 02:08:00,250
that are part of our development you

2910
02:08:04,590 --> 02:08:02,410
mean we just naturally become more aware

2911
02:08:06,180 --> 02:08:04,600
of the universe like we became more

2912
02:08:09,840 --> 02:08:06,190
aware that there's galaxies out there

2913
02:08:11,160 --> 02:08:09,850
and that this just becomes available to

2914
02:08:14,459 --> 02:08:11,170
our sense

2915
02:08:17,310 --> 02:08:14,469
as we evolved something and I got that

2916
02:08:20,340 --> 02:08:17,320
kind of thinking yeah I suppose that's

2917
02:08:24,990 --> 02:08:20,350
possible where the phenomenon is a way

2918
02:08:29,810 --> 02:08:25,000
to advance humans then as we advance as

2919
02:08:33,000 --> 02:08:29,820
a species things happen to us that we

2920
02:08:36,030 --> 02:08:33,010
need as part of our developmental

2921
02:08:38,189 --> 02:08:36,040
process our collective unconscious or

2922
02:08:41,990 --> 02:08:38,199
something so we're being given the

2923
02:08:45,479 --> 02:08:42,000
incentive to ultimately develop

2924
02:08:46,260 --> 02:08:45,489
spaceships and leave this planet explore

2925
02:08:49,169 --> 02:08:46,270
the universe

2926
02:08:51,570 --> 02:08:49,179
that's our imperative now is that mother

2927
02:08:53,760 --> 02:08:51,580
nature is sending us a signal that Earth

2928
02:08:56,430 --> 02:08:53,770
is not going to last forever and we've

2929
02:08:59,910 --> 02:08:56,440
got to go to the stars mmm mother

2930
02:09:01,380 --> 02:08:59,920
nature's is sort of yeah well I suppose

2931
02:09:04,200 --> 02:09:01,390
you could look at it in the largest

2932
02:09:07,620 --> 02:09:04,210
sense that everything is natural to some

2933
02:09:11,160 --> 02:09:07,630
extent if it's a product of the universe

2934
02:09:15,240 --> 02:09:11,170
but when you get looking at okay there's

2935
02:09:17,160 --> 02:09:15,250
a Air Force Base and it picks up a UFO

2936
02:09:18,840 --> 02:09:17,170
on its radar and sends a couple of jets

2937
02:09:22,080 --> 02:09:18,850
up and they pick up that UFO on their

2938
02:09:24,180 --> 02:09:22,090
radar and then they make a visual on it

2939
02:09:27,180 --> 02:09:24,190
as well and it looks like it's some sort

2940
02:09:29,400 --> 02:09:27,190
of disc and they close in on it enough

2941
02:09:33,689 --> 02:09:29,410
to make it out in daylight I mean we're

2942
02:09:35,100 --> 02:09:33,699
that's getting pretty specific about the

2943
02:09:37,560 --> 02:09:35,110
type of thing that we're talking about

2944
02:09:39,090 --> 02:09:37,570
and it's no longer just a nebulous well

2945
02:09:41,370 --> 02:09:39,100
it could be this or that mother nature

2946
02:09:44,160 --> 02:09:41,380
thing we're talking about something very

2947
02:09:46,490 --> 02:09:44,170
physical and right before the senses of

2948
02:09:49,350 --> 02:09:46,500
people who observing it while it's being

2949
02:09:51,930 --> 02:09:49,360
instrumentally detected all right that's

2950
02:09:54,000 --> 02:09:51,940
a good possibility - let me get back to

2951
02:09:56,580 --> 02:09:54,010
some of your previous guests why don't

2952
02:09:58,110 --> 02:09:56,590
you go through some more lists of who

2953
02:10:01,080 --> 02:09:58,120
you thought were stars and you thought

2954
02:10:03,660 --> 02:10:01,090
were Dutch well we had paula Harris on

2955
02:10:06,050 --> 02:10:03,670
once and we kind of ended the

2956
02:10:08,850 --> 02:10:06,060
conversation like a few minutes before

2957
02:10:10,919 --> 02:10:08,860
the show concluded with well we're not

2958
02:10:13,530 --> 02:10:10,929
going to go anywhere with this and where

2959
02:10:15,209 --> 02:10:13,540
it got off the rails in addition

2960
02:10:17,490 --> 02:10:15,219
everything else let's do the break we'll

2961
02:10:20,140 --> 02:10:17,500
talk about that in our next segment with

2962
02:10:31,990 --> 02:10:20,150
Gene Randall and Lois you're in the

2963
02:10:36,889 --> 02:10:32,000
para cast thank you for listening to GCS

2964
02:10:42,509 --> 02:10:39,869
hi this is Ted Anderson I'm here to tell

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you about GC and telecare dot-com a team

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hi Peter Picaro for paranormal date.com

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3018
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3019
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social unrest and violent marches yet

3020
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again may lead to looting of stores and

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city shutdowns and a crumbling

3022
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infrastructure leaves our power grid

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single cyberattack when the chaos from

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any one of these threats arises the

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government knows it can't provide during

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a widespread national emergency that's

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why you need your own plan for

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and savings in jeopardy you need this

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3060
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3061
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3062
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3063
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nine there's a reason that the largest

3064
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investment banking company in the world

3065
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million ounces of silver this free book

3067
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will explain it eight eight eight seven

3068
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seventy two twenty nine twenty nine hi

3069
02:14:49,729 --> 02:14:47,789
this is Bryce Abel I'm the producer of

3070
02:14:51,649 --> 02:14:49,739
dark skies the co-author of AD after

3071
02:14:53,799 --> 02:14:51,659
disclosure and you are listening to the

3072
02:14:56,170 --> 02:14:53,809
para cast the gold standard of

3073
02:15:02,810 --> 02:14:56,180
paranormal radio

3074
02:15:06,870 --> 02:15:02,820
[Music]

3075
02:15:08,670 --> 02:15:06,880
so one of the guests that kind of took

3076
02:15:11,550 --> 02:15:08,680
us off the rails in terms of her

3077
02:15:13,730 --> 02:15:11,560
participation was Paula Harris who

3078
02:15:17,880 --> 02:15:13,740
claims to be some kind of reporter and

3079
02:15:19,920 --> 02:15:17,890
we had her on the para cast once a long

3080
02:15:23,400 --> 02:15:19,930
time ago with the original co-host and

3081
02:15:25,050 --> 02:15:23,410
towards the end we questioned her where

3082
02:15:28,440 --> 02:15:25,060
she said that she thought that Billy

3083
02:15:32,100 --> 02:15:28,450
Meyer was the real deal and we want to

3084
02:15:34,500 --> 02:15:32,110
maybe have her justify that and she

3085
02:15:36,810 --> 02:15:34,510
denied saying it and evidently of course

3086
02:15:39,360 --> 02:15:36,820
she did say it and maybe she was

3087
02:15:41,280 --> 02:15:39,370
embarrassed saying it or said it to

3088
02:15:46,350 --> 02:15:41,290
benefit a particular audience that she

3089
02:15:49,020 --> 02:15:46,360
reached that subject almost came to an

3090
02:15:54,150 --> 02:15:49,030
end very closely before the show

3091
02:15:58,110 --> 02:15:54,160
concluded interesting back in 2009 we

3092
02:16:01,230 --> 02:15:58,120
had das Smith a forum member who claimed

3093
02:16:03,990 --> 02:16:01,240
to be an expert at remote viewing so we

3094
02:16:07,550 --> 02:16:04,000
thought hey let's put it to the test and

3095
02:16:10,050 --> 02:16:07,560
so we set up a test where he tell us

3096
02:16:14,460 --> 02:16:10,060
what was hidden from him to give us some

3097
02:16:19,170 --> 02:16:14,470
information he passed the test all right

3098
02:16:21,120 --> 02:16:19,180
the show was done April 26 2009 now for

3099
02:16:22,560 --> 02:16:21,130
many thousands of reasons he was never

3100
02:16:24,990 --> 02:16:22,570
on again I was about to put them on

3101
02:16:28,440 --> 02:16:25,000
recently and we just didn't get around

3102
02:16:31,410 --> 02:16:28,450
to it I'd like to though because that is

3103
02:16:34,200 --> 02:16:31,420
something that's interesting interesting

3104
02:16:37,860 --> 02:16:34,210
discussion test a remote viewing on the

3105
02:16:41,160 --> 02:16:37,870
other hand we had someone else here

3106
02:16:44,400 --> 02:16:41,170
who was talking to us about the

3107
02:16:47,720 --> 02:16:44,410
hieronymus Box the wishing machine Louis

3108
02:16:52,140 --> 02:16:47,730
you've heard about this I did not know

3109
02:16:53,280 --> 02:16:52,150
okay we have Joshua Warren who claims to

3110
02:16:55,669 --> 02:16:53,290
be one of those people who claims to be

3111
02:16:59,730 --> 02:16:55,679
an expert a little over everything and

3112
02:17:02,990 --> 02:16:59,740
he had a manufacturing partner who built

3113
02:17:05,610 --> 02:17:03,000
the wishing machine The Veronicas Box

3114
02:17:08,879 --> 02:17:05,620
and I said okay I'll try it

3115
02:17:10,600 --> 02:17:08,889
they sent me one for a time I think it

3116
02:17:14,440 --> 02:17:10,610
may have actually worked

3117
02:17:16,541 --> 02:17:14,450
I don't know and then it didn't of

3118
02:17:19,060 --> 02:17:16,551
course I am moved now into a new

3119
02:17:22,090 --> 02:17:19,070
location I suppose it wouldn't hurt to

3120
02:17:27,791 --> 02:17:22,100
plug it in and try it nothing can get

3121
02:17:29,920 --> 02:17:27,801
worse well tell me about some other good

3122
02:17:33,490 --> 02:17:29,930
guests that you've been impressed with

3123
02:17:35,680 --> 02:17:33,500
to research the reasoning every man has

3124
02:17:38,291 --> 02:17:35,690
always one of our favorite guests he's a

3125
02:17:40,870 --> 02:17:38,301
lot of fun to have on the show and he's

3126
02:17:43,030 --> 02:17:40,880
honest he's brutally honest he tells you

3127
02:17:46,990 --> 02:17:43,040
what he thinks that's good we always

3128
02:17:50,440 --> 02:17:47,000
like Don Ecker because he has a certain

3129
02:17:52,300 --> 02:17:50,450
level of stories that he tells and he's

3130
02:17:54,450 --> 02:17:52,310
always outspoken he's a bit of a

3131
02:17:57,190 --> 02:17:54,460
curmudgeon that's okay

3132
02:17:59,440 --> 02:17:57,200
Nick Redferns a lot of fun because he

3133
02:18:03,041 --> 02:17:59,450
writes a lot fascinating books and he

3134
02:18:05,350 --> 02:18:03,051
comes up with interesting ideas I start

3135
02:18:07,600 --> 02:18:05,360
you thinking about things he wrote one

3136
02:18:11,230 --> 02:18:07,610
of the more compelling books with the

3137
02:18:12,310 --> 02:18:11,240
alternate explanation about Roswell it's

3138
02:18:16,090 --> 02:18:12,320
very important that we had him on the

3139
02:18:20,890 --> 02:18:16,100
show we also had a weird character on

3140
02:18:23,440 --> 02:18:20,900
January 1st a guy named Sean Correa and

3141
02:18:26,650 --> 02:18:23,450
he had his organization called anonymous

3142
02:18:35,230 --> 02:18:26,660
uprising where he hoped to raise a

3143
02:18:42,340 --> 02:18:35,240
million dollars for some kind of UFO

3144
02:18:44,530 --> 02:18:42,350
detection project now as of the time

3145
02:18:49,180 --> 02:18:44,540
we're doing this show which is September

3146
02:18:50,860 --> 02:18:49,190
21st he claimed to have raised one

3147
02:18:56,400 --> 02:18:50,870
hundred thousand seven hundred twenty

3148
02:18:58,960 --> 02:18:56,410
dollars but one of those donations a

3149
02:19:01,990 --> 02:18:58,970
hundred thousand dollars comes from an

3150
02:19:03,850 --> 02:19:02,000
alleged offline source all the other

3151
02:19:07,120 --> 02:19:03,860
donations were you know twenty-five

3152
02:19:12,870 --> 02:19:07,130
fifty a hundred dollars is on GoFundMe

3153
02:19:16,090 --> 02:19:12,880
it's still there I think once the

3154
02:19:17,570 --> 02:19:16,100
venture is more than a few weeks old it

3155
02:19:20,030 --> 02:19:17,580
kind of dies off

3156
02:19:21,469 --> 02:19:20,040
the hundred thousand dollars I suspect

3157
02:19:25,280 --> 02:19:21,479
may not have been real it may have been

3158
02:19:27,980 --> 02:19:25,290
just put there in order to get other

3159
02:19:30,860 --> 02:19:27,990
people to donate oh look we got somebody

3160
02:19:33,459 --> 02:19:30,870
giving $100,000 maybe someone will match

3161
02:19:36,139 --> 02:19:33,469
it the thing went nowhere

3162
02:19:38,809 --> 02:19:36,149
he made some claims about his background

3163
02:19:44,509 --> 02:19:38,819
that we checked out when seemed he was

3164
02:19:47,690 --> 02:19:44,519
real but really took us nowhere so in

3165
02:19:52,730 --> 02:19:47,700
some ways that's an interesting episode

3166
02:19:58,700 --> 02:19:52,740
because of the fact that he didn't do

3167
02:20:00,710 --> 02:19:58,710
what we thought would do blue this is

3168
02:20:03,020 --> 02:20:00,720
actually an interesting point so you

3169
02:20:05,540 --> 02:20:03,030
know as someone who's sort of been an

3170
02:20:08,090 --> 02:20:05,550
observer of what goes on in the field do

3171
02:20:10,160 --> 02:20:08,100
you think that that any amount of money

3172
02:20:13,760 --> 02:20:10,170
that we throw at the subject is really

3173
02:20:17,990 --> 02:20:13,770
going to get us the the evidence that we

3174
02:20:20,090 --> 02:20:18,000
need do you think that it is a problem

3175
02:20:25,820 --> 02:20:20,100
is solvable by throwing bags of money at

3176
02:20:28,969 --> 02:20:25,830
it I don't know that we could ever if in

3177
02:20:30,920 --> 02:20:28,979
my imaging in my imagination somehow

3178
02:20:33,200 --> 02:20:30,930
capturing one of these vehicles so that

3179
02:20:35,719 --> 02:20:33,210
we could pull it apart and talk to the

3180
02:20:38,330 --> 02:20:35,729
inhabitants I don't know that that would

3181
02:20:40,070 --> 02:20:38,340
take money supposedly they're just

3182
02:20:41,960 --> 02:20:40,080
technologically far in advance of us

3183
02:20:43,610 --> 02:20:41,970
whether it's technologically or they

3184
02:20:46,400 --> 02:20:43,620
understand physics so much better that

3185
02:20:48,559 --> 02:20:46,410
they can get been talking between

3186
02:20:51,170 --> 02:20:48,569
dimensions however you want to think of

3187
02:20:52,639 --> 02:20:51,180
it I do think though that would be

3188
02:20:54,469 --> 02:20:52,649
better if the governments were to

3189
02:20:58,820 --> 02:20:54,479
acknowledge the truth because I think

3190
02:21:02,080 --> 02:20:58,830
there would be more more possibility of

3191
02:21:04,790 --> 02:21:02,090
making contact with other the other

3192
02:21:10,700 --> 02:21:04,800
other or whatever other entities I'll

3193
02:21:14,179 --> 02:21:10,710
put it that way I why would you say that

3194
02:21:17,750 --> 02:21:14,189
aspect oh why do I think that yeah why

3195
02:21:20,150 --> 02:21:17,760
would you say that I think there's a lot

3196
02:21:21,679 --> 02:21:20,160
of what's the word you want to use the

3197
02:21:23,750 --> 02:21:21,689
links and the nods that's people who

3198
02:21:27,170 --> 02:21:23,760
talk about this subject or our little

3199
02:21:31,399 --> 02:21:27,180
off base or you know not well

3200
02:21:33,969 --> 02:21:31,409
psychologically I think that's been

3201
02:21:36,710 --> 02:21:33,979
at one least at one time the government

3202
02:21:38,929 --> 02:21:36,720
encouraged that and it's been picked up

3203
02:21:41,960 --> 02:21:38,939
and just permeates our society and

3204
02:21:44,359 --> 02:21:41,970
that's unfortunate I think unfortunately

3205
02:21:48,349 --> 02:21:44,369
also there are a lot of nut cases out

3206
02:21:50,269 --> 02:21:48,359
there who grab onto the subject to use

3207
02:21:51,920 --> 02:21:50,279
it to explain their behavior and their

3208
02:21:53,750 --> 02:21:51,930
theories and their thoughts about life

3209
02:21:55,729 --> 02:21:53,760
and so that just leads the subject

3210
02:22:00,469 --> 02:21:55,739
matter to but if it were legit

3211
02:22:02,420 --> 02:22:00,479
legitimized I think we would be better

3212
02:22:06,410 --> 02:22:02,430
able to pull apart and get real evidence

3213
02:22:11,300 --> 02:22:06,420
and see where that might lead us that's

3214
02:22:14,090 --> 02:22:11,310
all I see it I I don't so you're not

3215
02:22:16,309 --> 02:22:14,100
saying that that might sort of provide a

3216
02:22:21,080 --> 02:22:16,319
motivation to the aliens themselves to

3217
02:22:22,820 --> 02:22:21,090
initiate Aaron it could be I I realize

3218
02:22:26,450 --> 02:22:22,830
you know that almost fits in with the

3219
02:22:28,880 --> 02:22:26,460
kind of hierarchy of events the gene was

3220
02:22:32,330 --> 02:22:28,890
alluding to that might take place I

3221
02:22:34,790 --> 02:22:32,340
don't know I I just do know there's a

3222
02:22:37,820 --> 02:22:34,800
lot of disparaging condoms out there

3223
02:22:40,820 --> 02:22:37,830
just permeates our society and even as

3224
02:22:44,120 --> 02:22:40,830
recently as the Phoenix lights how they

3225
02:22:46,130 --> 02:22:44,130
had a skewer the one politician for just

3226
02:22:48,380 --> 02:22:46,140
asking honest questions and for that

3227
02:22:50,450 --> 02:22:48,390
matter the governor felt that he had to

3228
02:22:52,700 --> 02:22:50,460
keep a lid on it at first so it's one be

3229
02:22:55,570 --> 02:22:52,710
Asteria and only years later did he

3230
02:22:59,780 --> 02:22:55,580
admit that he himself had seen yeah the

3231
02:23:01,820 --> 02:22:59,790
the craft himself which which raises for

3232
02:23:04,460 --> 02:23:01,830
me another question why are we not with

3233
02:23:07,160 --> 02:23:04,470
so many iPhones out there now or

3234
02:23:09,530 --> 02:23:07,170
whatever phones that are capable of

3235
02:23:12,019 --> 02:23:09,540
taking pictures why are we not seeing a

3236
02:23:14,030 --> 02:23:12,029
lot more pictures of these things I'm

3237
02:23:15,889 --> 02:23:14,040
not aware that we are and with the

3238
02:23:18,050 --> 02:23:15,899
internet they should be all over the

3239
02:23:20,179 --> 02:23:18,060
place and that's just not happening

3240
02:23:22,910 --> 02:23:20,189
right but you member here also knows

3241
02:23:24,620 --> 02:23:22,920
remember Lou else up there most people

3242
02:23:27,920 --> 02:23:24,630
using iPhones are not looking up there

3243
02:23:30,019 --> 02:23:27,930
looking down and when they're looking up

3244
02:23:33,019 --> 02:23:30,029
they do capture things or lights in the

3245
02:23:35,450 --> 02:23:33,029
sky you know it's not that easy to take

3246
02:23:37,490 --> 02:23:35,460
a photograph unless the craft or

3247
02:23:39,139 --> 02:23:37,500
whatever it is is really close if it's

3248
02:23:41,090 --> 02:23:39,149
in the distance it's just gonna be a

3249
02:23:41,781 --> 02:23:41,100
light in this guy it could be anything

3250
02:23:44,451 --> 02:23:41,791
how many

3251
02:23:46,761 --> 02:23:44,461
UFO photos are there that shows

3252
02:23:49,131 --> 02:23:46,771
something distinctive enough to present

3253
02:23:50,751 --> 02:23:49,141
a mystery not that many there aren't

3254
02:23:53,091 --> 02:23:50,761
that and there are really really really

3255
02:23:56,350 --> 02:23:53,101
good UFO photos and because everybody

3256
02:23:59,961 --> 02:23:56,360
has a phone in their pocket now and

3257
02:24:02,691 --> 02:23:59,971
Samsung makes good cameras too so they

3258
02:24:04,911 --> 02:24:02,701
do have the equipment with which to take

3259
02:24:07,241 --> 02:24:04,921
those photos but they're not looking up

3260
02:24:10,371 --> 02:24:07,251
and when they are unless what they see

3261
02:24:12,081 --> 02:24:10,381
is close enough and they remember to

3262
02:24:14,661 --> 02:24:12,091
grab the camera in their pocket or

3263
02:24:17,111 --> 02:24:14,671
whatever you may not see something we've

3264
02:24:19,850 --> 02:24:17,121
got more to come with Louis Sheehan

3265
02:24:24,750 --> 02:24:19,860
Randall Murphy Jean Steinberg you're in

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02:24:24,760 --> 02:24:32,240
[Music]

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openly threatens the US and launches a

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new missile every other week their

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in the dark

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high that you make pipe you're listening

3373
02:28:49,600 --> 02:28:47,670
to the parrot rock what's your feeling

3374
02:28:53,420 --> 02:28:49,610
about that Randall Murphy about the

3375
02:28:55,520 --> 02:28:53,430
dearth of useful photos in light of the

3376
02:28:57,980 --> 02:28:55,530
fact that a billion people have pretty

3377
02:29:00,170 --> 02:28:57,990
good cameras now you know interesting

3378
02:29:03,500 --> 02:29:00,180
question I was just talking with someone

3379
02:29:06,440 --> 02:29:03,510
the other day who was telling me that

3380
02:29:11,570 --> 02:29:06,450
they were sitting in traffic and they

3381
02:29:14,630 --> 02:29:11,580
saw craft in the sky very clearly but

3382
02:29:17,480 --> 02:29:14,640
there's this sort of a factor this sort

3383
02:29:19,070 --> 02:29:17,490
of flabbergasting thing like you know am

3384
02:29:21,020 --> 02:29:19,080
I really seeing what I'm seeing and he

3385
02:29:23,360 --> 02:29:21,030
had a phone right next to him and didn't

3386
02:29:25,610 --> 02:29:23,370
take any pictures and this is someone

3387
02:29:28,160 --> 02:29:25,620
who comes across to me is it's fairly

3388
02:29:30,830 --> 02:29:28,170
believable and you know I have no way to

3389
02:29:33,830 --> 02:29:30,840
prove one way or the other but seeing

3390
02:29:37,070 --> 02:29:33,840
something like that really is kind of an

3391
02:29:39,050 --> 02:29:37,080
awe-inspiring sight I mean I know I've

3392
02:29:41,150 --> 02:29:39,060
seen one myself so have a number of

3393
02:29:43,210 --> 02:29:41,160
other people and in thinking of digging

3394
02:29:46,690 --> 02:29:43,220
out your phone and is just sort of

3395
02:29:49,640 --> 02:29:46,700
becomes waylaid is a priority to just

3396
02:29:51,800 --> 02:29:49,650
experiencing and watching the thing well

3397
02:29:53,150 --> 02:29:51,810
gene more good guess you'd had on it's

3398
02:29:55,160 --> 02:29:53,160
why those things where there's no one

3399
02:29:56,750 --> 02:29:55,170
guest there's a whole bunch of guests

3400
02:30:00,440 --> 02:29:56,760
that you liked you enjoyed the

3401
02:30:02,360 --> 02:30:00,450
interaction and so therefore we had good

3402
02:30:04,310 --> 02:30:02,370
times with them and we like to have them

3403
02:30:07,460 --> 02:30:04,320
back Chris rutkowski the Canadian UFO

3404
02:30:09,080 --> 02:30:07,470
researcher it's just great because you

3405
02:30:10,580 --> 02:30:09,090
think of him when you talk to him is

3406
02:30:11,000 --> 02:30:10,590
pretty straight-laced guy and he's very

3407
02:30:13,880 --> 02:30:11,010
funny

3408
02:30:16,340 --> 02:30:13,890
I like the British UFO researchers

3409
02:30:18,800 --> 02:30:16,350
because they have such an enlightened

3410
02:30:22,400 --> 02:30:18,810
view of the subject like Philip mantel

3411
02:30:24,380 --> 02:30:22,410
Greg Bishop is great because he is

3412
02:30:25,430 --> 02:30:24,390
willing to consider all sorts of

3413
02:30:29,870 --> 02:30:25,440
possibilities

3414
02:30:32,210 --> 02:30:29,880
he doesn't just believe he questions and

3415
02:30:34,850 --> 02:30:32,220
he talks and he allows people to have

3416
02:30:37,640 --> 02:30:34,860
their say I was glad to get whitley

3417
02:30:38,179 --> 02:30:37,650
strieber on the show after 10 years of

3418
02:30:41,269 --> 02:30:38,189
the power

3419
02:30:43,670 --> 02:30:41,279
in February of last year I was

3420
02:30:47,000 --> 02:30:43,680
disappointed that he didn't convince us

3421
02:30:49,519 --> 02:30:47,010
of anything I heard him speak a couple

3422
02:30:52,729 --> 02:30:49,529
of times in New York at a New York 40 in

3423
02:30:54,920 --> 02:30:52,739
society lecture where John keel and Tim

3424
02:30:57,939 --> 02:30:54,930
Beckley were running the shows back in

3425
02:31:00,380 --> 02:30:57,949
the early 90s and I don't know about

3426
02:31:02,779 --> 02:31:00,390
streamer I think something may have

3427
02:31:04,630 --> 02:31:02,789
really happened to him but some people

3428
02:31:07,250 --> 02:31:04,640
say he's just doing it to sell books

3429
02:31:10,279 --> 02:31:07,260
that might be pushing it yeah you know

3430
02:31:13,309 --> 02:31:10,289
Nick Redfern I once spoke with him I

3431
02:31:16,609 --> 02:31:13,319
call in the shows like I'm doing today

3432
02:31:19,189 --> 02:31:16,619
and I asked him in part why he was so

3433
02:31:20,989 --> 02:31:19,199
interested in the subject and part of

3434
02:31:24,559 --> 02:31:20,999
the reason was when he was growing up

3435
02:31:26,989 --> 02:31:24,569
his father was in the United Kingdom's

3436
02:31:30,620 --> 02:31:26,999
military and he participated in a large

3437
02:31:33,769 --> 02:31:30,630
NATO exercise in Maine braids and his

3438
02:31:37,010 --> 02:31:33,779
father was involved with radars and they

3439
02:31:39,620 --> 02:31:37,020
found they they picked up a lot of UFOs

3440
02:31:42,319 --> 02:31:39,630
on radars turning up those military

3441
02:31:44,870 --> 02:31:42,329
exercises a lot of headlines and papers

3442
02:31:46,580 --> 02:31:44,880
back from that era and I just think

3443
02:31:49,340 --> 02:31:46,590
that's interesting I always like to know

3444
02:31:51,620 --> 02:31:49,350
why someone is interested in UFOs and I

3445
02:31:54,859 --> 02:31:51,630
know that was a question thrown in my

3446
02:31:57,050 --> 02:31:54,869
direction when I called into this show

3447
02:31:58,580 --> 02:31:57,060
but I think it's something that should

3448
02:32:01,279 --> 02:31:58,590
be asked of every guest that you have

3449
02:32:03,139 --> 02:32:01,289
why it is that they're so interested and

3450
02:32:05,719 --> 02:32:03,149
they're willing to even risk their

3451
02:32:07,910 --> 02:32:05,729
reputation by delving into this subject

3452
02:32:10,219 --> 02:32:07,920
and I believe your former your former

3453
02:32:12,649 --> 02:32:10,229
co-host might have may have bowed out in

3454
02:32:14,389 --> 02:32:12,659
part because he felt that it was just

3455
02:32:15,800 --> 02:32:14,399
hurting his reputation and not getting

3456
02:32:17,689 --> 02:32:15,810
him anything for it

3457
02:32:20,420 --> 02:32:17,699
so I I do think it's an interesting

3458
02:32:21,949 --> 02:32:20,430
question to ask everyone that you bring

3459
02:32:24,920 --> 02:32:21,959
on so I would urge you to do that in the

3460
02:32:27,139 --> 02:32:24,930
future so that'll save me from posting

3461
02:32:30,500 --> 02:32:27,149
that question in your forum week after

3462
02:32:32,989 --> 02:32:30,510
week and I want also to mention I'm

3463
02:32:34,429 --> 02:32:32,999
gonna throw you a softball pitch but I

3464
02:32:36,889 --> 02:32:34,439
asked you this question about a week ago

3465
02:32:40,519 --> 02:32:36,899
how easy is it to download the podcast

3466
02:32:42,170 --> 02:32:40,529
plus onto your mobile phone go ahead and

3467
02:32:44,960 --> 02:32:42,180
tell us how easy it is I'm not a techie

3468
02:32:46,609 --> 02:32:44,970
so it doesn't sound easy to me but go

3469
02:32:49,460 --> 02:32:46,619
ahead and tell us how easy it is it's

3470
02:32:50,540 --> 02:32:49,470
very easy you set it up once and that's

3471
02:32:52,310 --> 02:32:50,550
automatic

3472
02:32:56,421 --> 02:32:52,320
and the setup you have to add the

3473
02:32:58,341 --> 02:32:56,431
podcast using the URL that we give you

3474
02:33:01,341 --> 02:32:58,351
when you sign up for para cast plus we

3475
02:33:03,620 --> 02:33:01,351
give you a custom URL and it's not an

3476
02:33:05,240 --> 02:33:03,630
iTunes URL it goes directly to our site

3477
02:33:07,700 --> 02:33:05,250
but it doesn't matter just a copy paste

3478
02:33:10,341 --> 02:33:07,710
you will then be asked to login the

3479
02:33:13,100 --> 02:33:10,351
login name is your forum name plus your

3480
02:33:16,970 --> 02:33:13,110
forum password once you log in it

3481
02:33:20,711 --> 02:33:16,980
becomes part of your podcast in Apple's

3482
02:33:23,690 --> 02:33:20,721
podcast app and downcast and other apps

3483
02:33:25,820 --> 02:33:23,700
android there are number of apps to do

3484
02:33:27,770 --> 02:33:25,830
it to and once you do that it will

3485
02:33:30,080 --> 02:33:27,780
update just like anything else

3486
02:33:34,091 --> 02:33:30,090
automatically or you pull it down and it

3487
02:33:36,711 --> 02:33:34,101
updates that's all it's not bigger but

3488
02:33:40,280 --> 02:33:36,721
can I subscribe on my computer and then

3489
02:33:42,770 --> 02:33:40,290
listen to it on my phone yeah okay you

3490
02:33:48,080 --> 02:33:42,780
have an iPhone right okay

3491
02:33:50,480 --> 02:33:48,090
iPhone by that 5's okay doesn't matter

3492
02:33:53,690 --> 02:33:50,490
by that okay I'm an iPhone right here

3493
02:33:55,070 --> 02:33:53,700
and this iPhone is running iOS 11 what's

3494
02:33:56,780 --> 02:33:55,080
your iPhone could do too we have only a

3495
02:33:59,780 --> 02:33:56,790
couple of minutes left so I want to do

3496
02:34:02,830 --> 02:33:59,790
this really quickly here okay there is

3497
02:34:09,020 --> 02:34:02,840
this app there's this podcast app and

3498
02:34:10,490 --> 02:34:09,030
you launch podcasts okay and there's a

3499
02:34:14,540 --> 02:34:10,500
way in there and I have to look at how

3500
02:34:20,360 --> 02:34:14,550
it's done there's a wing in there where

3501
02:34:22,940 --> 02:34:20,370
you can add the podcast and have an

3502
02:34:24,980 --> 02:34:22,950
update I have to look at the new

3503
02:34:27,320 --> 02:34:24,990
interface here because it's a little

3504
02:34:32,120 --> 02:34:27,330
different I think you have to go to your

3505
02:34:35,720 --> 02:34:32,130
library okay here's how you do it you go

3506
02:34:38,631 --> 02:34:35,730
to podcasts tap library tap edit and

3507
02:34:42,440 --> 02:34:38,641
then there's an option and a podcast by

3508
02:34:44,930 --> 02:34:42,450
URL and you paste the URL that we give

3509
02:34:47,900 --> 02:34:44,940
you when you sign up we send you a

3510
02:34:51,171 --> 02:34:47,910
letter you paste it there tap subscribe

3511
02:34:54,591 --> 02:34:51,181
you then log in to the forum and that's

3512
02:34:56,511 --> 02:34:54,601
how you get the power cast plus just

3513
02:34:58,671 --> 02:34:56,521
like that we're tech night-out plus if

3514
02:35:00,470 --> 02:34:58,681
you join that too and do I do that on my

3515
02:35:02,660 --> 02:35:00,480
phone or could I do it on your phone

3516
02:35:03,810 --> 02:35:02,670
okay I do it on your phone because if

3517
02:35:05,310 --> 02:35:03,820
you do it in iTunes

3518
02:35:08,820 --> 02:35:05,320
only be in iTunes you could do it on

3519
02:35:11,660 --> 02:35:08,830
iTunes on your Mac or a PC but on

3520
02:35:16,801 --> 02:35:11,670
remember again it's a manual Edition

3521
02:35:20,430 --> 02:35:16,811
podcast app choose library when you

3522
02:35:23,660 --> 02:35:20,440
choose library you then tap Edit and

3523
02:35:26,280 --> 02:35:23,670
when you tap Edit add a podcast by URL

3524
02:35:27,711 --> 02:35:26,290
the whole process will take you less

3525
02:35:30,480 --> 02:35:27,721
than a minute

3526
02:35:32,910 --> 02:35:30,490
so in the future for your future shows

3527
02:35:35,160 --> 02:35:32,920
and you and Chris are co-hosting

3528
02:35:37,740 --> 02:35:35,170
remember to ask your guests why they're

3529
02:35:41,100 --> 02:35:37,750
interested in the subject do me a favor

3530
02:35:43,171 --> 02:35:41,110
and find out from Paul Kimball get the

3531
02:35:48,060 --> 02:35:43,181
critique of his own movie what he now

3532
02:35:49,860 --> 02:35:48,070
sees as having been unhelpful hopefully

3533
02:35:52,950 --> 02:35:49,870
will prepare for a stand Freedman

3534
02:35:55,740 --> 02:35:52,960
grilling again I like the guy I respect

3535
02:35:57,150 --> 02:35:55,750
the guy greatly so just say grilling he

3536
02:36:00,060 --> 02:35:57,160
does deserve hard questions

3537
02:36:02,160 --> 02:36:00,070
he's fight enough to entertain them and

3538
02:36:03,780 --> 02:36:02,170
considering having Hastings on to talk

3539
02:36:05,761 --> 02:36:03,790
about his movie and perhaps more

3540
02:36:08,131 --> 02:36:05,771
chapters in his book beyond UFOs and

3541
02:36:10,650 --> 02:36:08,141
nukes because he has other interesting

3542
02:36:13,171 --> 02:36:10,660
writings including about Bentwaters lake

3543
02:36:16,291 --> 02:36:13,181
charlie is not involving nuclear net

3544
02:36:18,961 --> 02:36:16,301
weapons maybe it is and I want to thank

3545
02:36:20,461 --> 02:36:18,971
you for allowing a random listener to

3546
02:36:21,841 --> 02:36:20,471
call in and ask a lot of questions that

3547
02:36:23,761 --> 02:36:21,851
have been calling to his mind to it past

3548
02:36:24,961 --> 02:36:23,771
few years let me answer briefly about

3549
02:36:27,720 --> 02:36:24,971
Robert Hastings

3550
02:36:30,270 --> 02:36:27,730
he got rag Don in the form something

3551
02:36:34,200 --> 02:36:30,280
fierce at the time there's some people

3552
02:36:36,180 --> 02:36:34,210
who were against his ideas and posted

3553
02:36:38,881 --> 02:36:36,190
their objections in an objectionable way

3554
02:36:40,650 --> 02:36:38,891
if you get my point he may not as a

3555
02:36:42,541 --> 02:36:40,660
result won't come back on the show it's

3556
02:36:44,400 --> 02:36:42,551
unfortunate that happens sometimes as

3557
02:36:45,900 --> 02:36:44,410
the Paul Kimball he'll be back soon

3558
02:36:48,600 --> 02:36:45,910
maybe we'll give you the opportunity to

3559
02:36:52,620 --> 02:36:48,610
ask him yourself how does that work for

3560
02:36:55,220 --> 02:36:52,630
you okay

3561
02:36:57,930 --> 02:36:55,230
what do you do for a living by the way I

3562
02:37:01,530 --> 02:36:57,940
it's a long story but I'm currently

3563
02:37:04,860 --> 02:37:01,540
working for it what was st. Jude Medical

3564
02:37:06,810 --> 02:37:04,870
now Abbot and they make pacemakers and

3565
02:37:09,720 --> 02:37:06,820
so forth are involved with filings with

3566
02:37:12,961 --> 02:37:09,730
the FDA I was a lawyer for decades I

3567
02:37:15,720 --> 02:37:12,971
changed careers and sometimes I question

3568
02:37:17,550 --> 02:37:15,730
why in retrospect because I was making

3569
02:37:18,900 --> 02:37:17,560
much more money

3570
02:37:20,580 --> 02:37:18,910
but I didn't wanted to do something

3571
02:37:24,740 --> 02:37:20,590
different so I went back to school and

3572
02:37:27,950 --> 02:37:24,750
degree in biotechnology I'm trying to

3573
02:37:30,990 --> 02:37:27,960
carve out a new niche for myself in the

3574
02:37:34,440 --> 02:37:31,000
sciences good luck with a good luck for

3575
02:37:36,720 --> 02:37:34,450
the future you can find us on Twitter if

3576
02:37:39,540 --> 02:37:36,730
you look for the power cast look for to

3577
02:37:43,380 --> 02:37:39,550
power cast fan clubs on Facebook one of

3578
02:37:45,630 --> 02:37:43,390
them is a group the others a community

3579
02:37:47,180 --> 02:37:45,640
isn't that weird whatever you like we

3580
02:37:50,310 --> 02:37:47,190
have a second radio show of course

3581
02:37:52,020 --> 02:37:50,320
called after the power cast after the

3582
02:37:54,930 --> 02:37:52,030
power cast is part of the power cast

3583
02:37:59,070 --> 02:37:54,940
plus to learn more go to plus dr. power

3584
02:38:03,240 --> 02:37:59,080
cast calm that's PL us dot the power

3585
02:38:04,920 --> 02:38:03,250
cast calm for a low subscription rate we

3586
02:38:06,810 --> 02:38:04,930
give you after the power cast a version

3587
02:38:09,960 --> 02:38:06,820
of this show free of Network ads and

3588
02:38:14,970 --> 02:38:09,970
lots of other benefits and if you join

3589
02:38:17,940 --> 02:38:14,980
for five years or ten years you'll get a

3590
02:38:20,730 --> 02:38:17,950
free book or two we have several that we

3591
02:38:23,550 --> 02:38:20,740
offer supplies unlimited plus dot the

3592
02:38:26,340 --> 02:38:23,560
power cast calm our special guest host

3593
02:38:30,120 --> 02:38:26,350
of course was J Randall Murphy

3594
02:38:32,400 --> 02:38:30,130
we welcome loyal listener Louis Sheehan

3595
02:38:34,740 --> 02:38:32,410
and you know he can talk well because he

3596
02:38:36,900 --> 02:38:34,750
is a lawyer that explains a lot

3597
02:38:39,090 --> 02:38:36,910
Bloo thanks for joining us on the power

3598
02:38:53,850 --> 02:38:39,100
cast and thank you thank you for

3599
02:39:00,400 --> 02:38:57,370
the para cast featuring gene Steinberg

3600
02:39:03,270 --> 02:39:00,410
and Christopher O'Brien is a copyrighted

3601
02:39:07,180 --> 02:39:03,280
presentation of making the impossible